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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: We might not benchmark against CEFR and we might not be saying we are setting out for a B2 standard or whatever else. Are we, though, benchmarking in terms of language outcomes, aside from the CEFR?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I am sorry for interrupting, but I am very much aware of it and know it went through a couple of editions. The big fold-out one was the original, which did not go down terribly well. I am going to come back to my point. Are we internationally benchmarking? Are we saying that Dutch kids, for example, come out with this level of English at age 12 and Irish kids come out with this level of...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: Are those standardised tests not used only in T1 schools?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I do not know of any T2 Irish language schools where-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: Are they similar to the Micra-T or Drumcondra tests?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I want to talk a little about science. I have a little bit of a worry about how we are aligning science with mathematics and technology. I will talk about science as three subjects. As it splits out into the leaving certificate, science becomes physics, chemistry and biology. I am concerned with where we are placing science, which is within the engineering, technology and mathematics...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: We would have a friction in our views, let us say. We should have a clear idea that children coming through the Irish education system will know about their Stone Age peoples. In the context of migration and the debate around migration, people in Waterford should be saying we that had Stone Age peoples here, then the Vikings founded the city, then the Normans came in and then the Huguenots...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: It probably did not amount to a question. I do not know what I would call it if I were being charitable to myself. I will give another three minutes. I will be strict on that because we are going into a second session at 12.30 p.m. Senator Flynn has three minutes to put questions to the witnesses.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I said I would be strict with the three minutes, so we will take the Senator's contribution as a statement.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: To be fair to the Department, I think that might be a matter of policy as opposed to-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: It would be a direction. I call Senator Mullen.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I ask Dr. Sullivan to be very brief.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I am sorry. We are over time. We are to begin the next session at 12.30 p.m. I want to let Dr. Sullivan complete his answer but then I am moving to the next session.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Update on the Draft Curriculum Specifications at Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I have allowed members to come back in for an additional three minutes but I am afraid that is it. We have to move to the next session at 12.30 p.m. I thank the officials for coming here today. The briefings were very informative and beneficial. We will now suspend for a few minutes while we move to the second session. Some of our witnesses will remain.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: We are discussing the integration of early years learning.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I am not sure it is appropriate or in line.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: It does not relate to the integration of early years learning into primary years education.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: The Senator is referring to something that was dealt with in our previous session.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: It may be a matter of public interest but the question has been asked and answered in detail.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Integration of Early Years Learning into Primary Level: Discussion (5 Nov 2024)

Marc Ó Cathasaigh: I will ask a few questions of my own. The Aistear programme is excellent. I have not had sight of the reformulated version, but it has been transformative for early years education. However, we find ourselves in a peculiar situation whereby, through the ECCE programme, we are starting formal education through what is essentially a privatised setting. While it is funded by the State, much...

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