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Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Can I just, finally then ... and Deputy O'Donnell touched on it, when, a year and a half to two years after you left your role, you became a member of the board of Merrill Lynch-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: -----could you imagine how, to a member of the general public, that would look like a conflict of interest for somebody who had worked their entire life in regulation and Central Bank and got to the position of chief executive of the regulator, retired on a substantial pension paid for by the taxpayers, and then ended up taking a position on the board of Merrill Lynch and, subsequently, on...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: The question I asked though was the perception of the conflict of interest between the chief executive of the regulator then going, as it were, to the other side of the fence.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: I'm not making any accusations against you personally, Mr. O'Reilly, but ... but that perception exists.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Thank you Chairman. Good afternoon Mr. Patterson. Can I ask you firstly your views on the efficacy, it is bound to have been touched on by some of the previous questioners, but the efficacy of principles-based regulation and did those views change from the time that you were appointed chairman and through your time as chairman and subsequently?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Can I ask you following on from the first question, I think, from Deputy O'Donnell, in relation to your appointment, why do you believe yourself that you were chosen or did you have a discussion with the then Minister for Finance or the Minister for Enterprise I think you referenced in your opening statement? I am not sure who that Minister-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Effectively from your opening statement you have given examples that while it was a new organisation, really from a staffing point of view people were coming across from the Central Bank so a new structure may have been created but the same operatives, to use that maybe awful term, were in the places they might have always occupied, is that correct?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: You had extensive experience in management in a number of leading national and international businesses, is that fair to say? I want not to dwell on what has been asked previously but you highlighted in your opening comments about the absence of experiencing bank regulation from the membership of the board and you said that you suggested to the Minister that should be rectified and that that...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: It was too ... okay, it was too limited. Can I then also follow on, on to page 4 of your opening statement where you stated under the heading of "Resourcing", the final two bullet points there, where you said that performance management systems and practices were very weak and organisation culture was formal and slow. Can I ask what did you do as chairperson to try and change those two...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: I am going to present a position and I am trying not to be leading because I know the Chairman will be on to me but somebody who comes with such a distinguished CV in terms of management to the position that you were appointed to, to come in here and give your presentation - and I have no reason to doubt your integrity in giving it - but to lay out criticisms which are of a managerial nature...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: But you were the chairman or acting chairman for five and a half years?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Which is a long time in corporate terms.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Okay. I then want to turn to another quote from your opening statement and I think ... seem to have lost what page it was on, but I'll read it to you. You said that "The authority was very conscious that if [...] the capital requirements of Irish banks were pushed too high, foreign banks which could move beyond our supervisory reach could [...] have gained advantage over their Irish...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Are you suggesting that, fundamentally, the way the organisation was structured, in that sense, was a deep flaw, effectively, from the beginning; that it hampered what many people would perceive as the primary function of the regulator, which would be to regulate?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: I only-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: I only have one minute left, so I want to ask you one final question. On page 1 of your presentation, you outlined a detailed, four line of defence structure against bank failure. First of all, I wanted to ask briefly from whose point of view are you ... is that constructed? Is it from the point of view of the taxpayer, the State, the shareholders? How did you come up with that construct?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Would you hold to the view, as I suspect - this is the last one - that many taxpayers who might be watching here today that, fundamentally, the regulator is the first line of defence, from the taxpayer's point of view, in terms of banking supervision and banking failure and, like, while the boards may have a responsibility, particularly for shareholders, but that the regulator's primary ......

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: But the taxpayer has been left with a-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (11 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: -----€7 billion of a bill.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (10 Jun 2015)

John Paul Phelan: Ms O'Dea, and welcome. I have a couple of questions for you. Firstly, in relation to your predecessor, Mr. Neary ... he left the role in January ... 31 January 2009. Do you believe that he was forced out of the position at the time?

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