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Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: That is correct.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Yes, I know.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: I will make a few suggestions. First, while the name of the person mentioned in this letter is in the public arena, we have not put it in the public arena, and I propose we redact the person's name before we publish the letter. The name is out there but it is not for us to put it out there. The name is mentioned three or four times in the letter but it will be redacted when we publish it....

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Allow me to finish. There is a complete distinction between suspected fraud and instances of non-compliance with procedures. Suspected fraud cases mean a potential loss to An Garda Síochána as money would be paid out in a fraudulent manner. Fraud is a criminal issue, not a HR issue. Do members understand the distinction I am making? I am not trying to muddy the waters, but...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: We will send the transcript of this discussion to An Garda Síochána in order to give it a precise understanding of the issues raised. We need clarification on whether these three cases are separate from the case about which we are talking. It is quite possible that these cases were disciplinary and that the case to which we are referring is criminal. I want to know whether the...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: We will send the transcript and put the questions to which members want answers. We will publish this letter, redacting the name of the person concerned. That is noted and published with redaction. Correspondence No. 2450B is from Mr. Tom Doherty, chief operations officer of Teagasc, providing an information note requested by the committee about the number of contracts that were...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: It is interesting that, in this day and age, €250 million has essentially been locked into a State agency's account. It has no immediate purpose for that fund and there is no provision to pay it back to the Government by way of a dividend, so it is locked in. We have to find a mechanism in order to use it for an appropriate purpose. I thank Deputy MacSharry for raising this issue....

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Okay. Is there anyone else we can ask to try to give us that assurance?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: It is vague. We have not yet received a satisfactory answer.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Okay. We are going to write to the Department to clarify this point. Members can see that it is an ongoing issue. It has been before this committee for a couple of years. It was before the last Committee of Public Accounts as well. We will note the correspondence. We will not publish it because it is from a private individual. We will ask the Department to respond. I think that under...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Can we agree to send this correspondence to the Department, accompanied by a request for a detailed response? We do not want to hear what its policy is: we want to know what it is doing to ensure voted moneys that are set aside for children with special needs in schools throughout the country are being used specifically for such purposes. It would be dreadful to think that this is happening...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: We need to ask those questions. I am not sure whether boards of management have to audit the income of schools, such as capitation grants and other grants. Maybe members can tell me whether they do. I am not talking about teacher salaries because they come straight from the Department. It goes without saying that all schools are tight on money. I am involved in my local community...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Tight.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Okay. We will ask the Department for a detailed response. I know there are major gaps in whole-school evaluation reports. If a school building is collapsing, it will not be covered in the whole-school evaluation report. We will ask the Department to respond to what has been highlighted.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: I thank the Deputy. We will send a transcript of this discussion to the Department with a covering letter in order to ensure it is familiar with the issues members have raised. We will note this item of correspondence and we will contact the Department directly on it. Next is No. 2445, from Deputy Kate O'Connell, who is requesting further information from Bord na gCon regarding the post...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: Okay. We will do that. It is agreed that we will ask for a detailed response. The final item today is No. 2446, dated 10 October, from Deputy David Cullinane, who is requesting further information from the National Transport Authority. We sent a detailed list to the authority arising from last week's meeting. The Deputy has a few other issues he wants to raise. Is it agreed that those...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: We probably will not sit if the Houses are not sitting, in which case we will have to postpone that meeting. It is up to members but if it is a sitting week, we should schedule a meeting. If it is not a sitting week, the members can decide-----

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: I do not know. Of course, it could make a decision and then be forced to change it, depending on events. The point is well made and there is a question mark over that meeting because we are not quite sure what will happen. If the Dáil is not sitting, will we take it that this committee will not sit? If the Dáil is sitting that week, we will proceed with the meeting. Is that agreed?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: I do not think people will come up if the Dáil is not sitting. We understand where we are on that and the difficulty will be rescheduling. The next item is a meeting with the Department of Employment Affairs and Social Protection followed by a meeting the following week with the Office of Public Works, OPW. There are chapters in the Comptroller and Auditor General's report on both....

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (17 Oct 2019)

Seán Fleming: We want that organisation here that week because there is activity going on, outside of construction, which is under its remit. I refer here to getting patient records systems in place and so on. Children's Health Ireland commenced functioning on 1 January this year but work was being done on that project prior to that. That body has not been before this committee yet but it is a...

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