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Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Of all banks or of some banks?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: So can I just settle this so. We have the Minister for Finance inside in the room, pro-nationalisation of Anglo bank, we have Kevin Cardiff inside the room looking for the nationalisation of Anglo Irish Bank. We have yourself and Mr. Hurley of an opposed view and we have the NTMA outside the room, who were also of a pro-nationalisation of Anglo Irish Bank. Am I correct in that?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. Well, is your testimony this evening that the three parties now that are on record that are in favour of nationalising Anglo are Mr. Cardiff, Mr. Lenihan and the NTMA?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay, thank you.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. Next questioner, John Paul Phelan.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: All right, Deputy, we have to move on. Final question if you've anything else. Okay, thank you very much. All right, the next questioner is Deputy Michael McGrath.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Thank you, I'm going to start moving things to wrapping up, Mr. Cowen, after which then I'll invite the two leads from today. If I can just clear up with you just one question and then deal with two matters. Mr. Cowen, if I could ask you in regard to, it's in your own opening statement, I think it's in paragraph 301 of your statement you say, "Broadening the tax base, creating new sources...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: I'm going to read some figures to you during that period, and these are all figures relating to 2002-2006. The first graph I have up there, it's at the top of the page, and what you'll see is capital gains tax as a percentage of total revenue, this is the overall revenue figure. And in or around 2002 it makes up 2% of the overall figure, going up to 6% of the overall revenue in the period...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Yes. But we move on then, to the next one, and we go inclusive. The next one up is stamp duty as a percentage of total revenue, from 2002-2006 that moves from 4% up to 8% of total revenue. And then on to the next diagram which is the total level of cyclical taxes as a percentage of revenue moving from 2002 to 2006. In or around 2002 it's just in around maybe 22.5% and coming into 30% of...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Would cyclical taxes almost approaching a third of total revenue be seen as an indicator that there may be something happening in the economy that requires cooling down, re-examination and other measures that would have to be addressed, regardless of what's happening inside in the banks, that this could be an issue?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Do those figures and that brings me to the final question on this matter ... do those figures support or question the soft landing theory?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. Just two other matters there, Mr. Cowen, so. When did David Doyle indicate to you that he supported the all-inclusive guarantee? Was it in the meeting or were you aware of a view that he may have had before you actually went to Government Buildings that night?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Was there any prior discussion between yourself and Mr. Doyle as to the shape and design of the guarantee before Government Buildings that night?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: On that evening or at other times?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Earlier when? Earlier hours or earlier days?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. So you were aware that Mr. Doyle had a shaped opinion or a growing opinion in his head as to the design of the guarantee and that it would be all-inclusive? And that would be inclusive?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (8 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: That's what I'm trying to clarify.

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