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Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: May I respond to the Deputy's question regarding the decision not to inform the McCabes?

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: I do not have that information at present. The only place where there is any information about that of which I am aware at this point is in the file that the Ministers, Deputies Zappone and Harris, have in relation to the contacts of HSE and counsellors. I do not have that information but I will try to get it in terms of reply to the questions from Sergeant McCabe in regard to the contact...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The wish of this House has been that we should use commissions of investigation as opposed to tribunals of inquiry. Therefore, the focus in recent times has been very much on commissions of investigation. In relation to further legislation regarding tribunals, I certainly do not want to delay the establishment of this tribunal by starting to change the terms of reference or how tribunals...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: There is a very easy answer to the Deputy's question. I met Maurice McCabe and his wife some time ago because I felt it was important to meet him and hear what he had to say given the various events that were happening at that time. He made a request to meet me so I met him. There is a reason I did not change the terms of reference. If I had come into the House and changed the terms of...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: When the judge was given this task and looked at the protected disclosures he said they were unique because they were about the most senior members of An Garda Síochána and incredibly serious. He said that if, at the end of the process, it was proven that whomever was not telling the full truth, there would be the most serious consequences. He said that these matters should be...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: I have never commented on other disclosures that I have received and I believe it is incumbent on me not to do so. In fact, I have only given details in respect of the protected disclosures that are relevant to the setting up of the commission. I have only commented on those in so far as I needed to do so to establish the commission. I want to make the point to Deputy Kelly that I do not...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: We have a process to investigate protected disclosures. Every Department receives protected disclosures and there are clear ways of dealing with them. When I get a protected disclosure from a member of An Garda Síochána, and there have been a number of them, GSOC is the body that has been appointed to investigate-----

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: We spend a lot of time in this House talking about setting up-----

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: We spend a lot of time in this House talking about setting up independent procedures to remove policing from this House. We give these protected disclosures to GSOC so that they can be independently assessed. That is what I did with the information I received.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The Deputy's party thrives on rushing to judgment. She is wrong to say that I misled the Dáil. I did not know that there had been contact between the Garda and Tusla when I was in here last week. If I had known it, I would have thought of saying it to the Deputy when she asked the question.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The Deputy may not believe me, but I am telling her that is what happened. She rushed to judgment immediately and said that I had misled the Dáil and that I did not mention other agencies. I did not know about the Tusla involvement.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: It is a very good question. Mr. Justice Charlton will be the person dealing with that. He has given some indication already that he will also take independent expert advice on the management of all those issues.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: I appreciate the importance of the issue Deputy Micheál Martin raises. There is always ongoing contact between An Garda Síochána and Tusla. There is a very close interaction in relation to child sexual abuse. In this case, the counsellor, as I understand it from that file, which I just got yesterday, was the person dealing with the issue to begin with. The Deputy asking...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: When we had the debate here last week, it was statements in order to hear what people had to say about the terms of reference. I gave an indication that I would accept various amendments which had been put forward. After I had seen the "Prime Time" programme, it became very clear there should be a specific reference to Tusla or, indeed, other agencies. Now, I would include the HSE as well....

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: Mr. Justice O'Neill investigated and did a preliminary report into the allegations that had been made. I made a mistake earlier when I said that Mr. Justice Charleton had done so. It was Mr. Justice O'Neill, so I want to correct that. I have just realised that I had said that. In his preliminary report, Mr. Justice O'Neill made contact with all of the people who were involved in the...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: I am not hiding behind anything but telling the Deputy the facts. I had a protected disclosure. The Deputy seems to know what is in that protected disclosure.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The Deputy says it is about child sexual abuse allegations but the protected disclosure in the terms of reference was to do with a smear campaign. When I say I had no information or briefing, I am not hiding behind any one file. The allegations are not in any file I hold, or in anything of which I was aware. Deputy Wallace asked me about An Garda Síochána but I have no...

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The judge decided that any allegation of criminal misconduct made against sergeant McCabe should be included in the terms of reference. It would cover sexual allegations.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: The Deputy misunderstands me and is misrepresenting what I am saying.

Clarification of Statements made by the Taoiseach and Ministers: Statements (Resumed) (14 Feb 2017)

Frances Fitzgerald: What I said in the Dáil last week was absolutely accurate and that is plain to anyone who reads the record of the House. What reason would I have to mislead the House in this matter? What would I be trying to hide? I freely admit that I was scrupulous in referring to Sergeant McCabe at all times, lest I put anything on the record of the House that might be damaging to him. In...

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