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Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I respect the Cathaoirleach's position but I have to say that if a baby survives in this situation, it may be very much in need of what is called perinatal hospice care, although normally it does occur in the context of a situation where a tragic diagnosis of abnormality or disability is received and parents and baby need to be consoled and supported but it does arise in this case here. I...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The Minister's answer is very problematic. For the Minister for Health, who is introducing abortion on wide-ranging grounds, to say that he is unfamiliar with research about where situations have arisen in other countries-----

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The Minister has had two years to familiarise himself with the stories and the documented evidence. He is the one who is introducing abortion, not me.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I would have thought that the Minister championing the introduction of abortion-----

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: -----would be interested enough to pursue the question of whether it ever occurs that babies survive abortion procedures and what happens to them in various jurisdictions. The Minister has a phalanx of advisers, a chief medical officer and the negligence of the situation, to put it kindly, that he would not be familiar with what happens to the point that he could in any way discuss whether...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The Minister is changing this. That was best medical practice, under Irish law and under Medical Council guidelines.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: There is absolutely no question it is why Ireland's maternal mortality rates were among the lowest in the world. It was clearly understood as a matter of law that there was a duty to preserve life that was always in situ, even if that resulted in the death of the unborn. That was best medical practice in this country and was underpinned by law, not just by Medical Council guidelines. The...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: He is causing a revolution in medical care of all the wrong kind. There would be no legislation if it was only a matter for medics. It would just be that abortion is permissible and it would be left up to medics to decide. This legislation is full of rules. The trouble is it is full of vague rules that leave open all sorts of dangerous, in some cases unforeseen and perhaps, sadly, in some...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The Minister is under a duty to know that.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The fact that the Minister chooses to have such a narrow interpretation and understanding of his duty is remarkable in itself. He has been instrumental in bringing about a situation where an unborn baby does not have rights, to all intents and purposes in all sorts of situations, and has left a lacuna where such a baby is born. He has created a right to carry out and access a procedure that...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: The Minister should be open to this, even from a precautionary point of view. We are no different from other countries now as we no longer have constitutional protection for the unborn. We need to be clear that there is now no obligation that will override the lacuna in the legislation. The very fact there is a lacuna in the legislation will cover any future instance of deliberate neglect...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I will conclude.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I do not think I have referred to Mr. Thompson previously so this is new and relevant information that relates to this amendment. When pressed at the committee, this neonatalogist said the procedure was that there would be one injection to stop the baby moving or, as he said, to "paralyse" the baby. He said the second injection in the foeticide was an injection to the heart, part of the...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I move amendment No. 36:In page 10, between lines 27 and 28, to insert the following: “Administration of anaesthetic or analgesic to foetus14. (1) A medical practitioner who carries out a termination of pregnancy shall take all steps as may be appropriate and practicable to avoid causing pain to the foetus.(2) Where the medical practitioner who is carrying out a termination of...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: Understood.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I accept that the Minister may have revised his position or the language he uses in putting it forward since the matter was discussed in the Lower House. However, he has given no other reason for opposing the amendment similar to this one, which was tabled in the Lower House. That is why it is necessary for me to dwell on what is the Minister's objection to this humane and humanising,...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: Recent research from the United States indicates that they can feel pain as early as 18 weeks and that anaesthetics should be used from that point. We propose that they be used from 20 weeks. We have tried to avoid any unnecessary ambiguities. As I stated, the amendment does not apply to abortions under section 10 or where there is a reasonable belief that harm might be caused to the...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I continue to thank Senator Norris for his very respectful disagreement with me and it is appreciated because many people regard it as an enormously tragic development in Irish life that we have abandoned the two-patient model and that we have lost empathy officially with unborn children. I am sorry to have to say that the Minister is back to the Orwellian doublespeak when he says that this...

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: I have pointed out to the Minister that there is legislation he supported that requires the administration of pain relief in certain situations to animals. I note that he did not answer that.

Seanad: Health (Regulation of Termination of Pregnancy) Bill 2018: Committee Stage (Resumed) (11 Dec 2018)

Rónán Mullen: There are certain phrases that get used in politics, a Chathaoirligh, which include "This has nothing to do with the amendment", "This is not appropriate for legislation", "This could have unintended consequences"-----

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