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Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: ----- and within the PAYE system, close companies pay tax through salaries that are taxed. Is that the way it works?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: That is okay. I just wanted to get an overview of the close company structure, which Dr. Keegan has just explained. I now ask Dr. Keegan to address the issue of the variation noted in the chapter by the Comptroller and Auditor General. I ask him to explain that to people. The statutory rate is 12.5% but the effective rate can vary from 12.5% right down to 0%. In private session Dr....

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: Mr. Keegan is saying that the effective rate for the top ten or top 100 companies can be as low as 0% because of legitimate ways of not paying tax through use of research and development credits or the purchase of intellectual property. Is that correct?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: That is okay. I am just trying to understand it all. The Revenue Commissioners will be coming before the committee and we want to understand the system.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: Of the top 100 companies, most are probably benefitting from the research and development credit. To be fair, they are probably companies that are most suited to carrying out research and development, like pharmaceutical companies. Is that right?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: Is it the case the other companies in Ireland, mainly indigenous companies, are not able to make the most of the research and development credit or similar methods for reducing the corporation tax payable?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: At the risk of raising a rotten apple, I will discuss the Apple case in a general way. It was mentioned in the up-to-date briefing document. The witnesses referred to residency. Is incorporation of the company important?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: The situation also depends on double taxation agreements, residency and so on. However, there are always criteria that determine where a company is taxed. Dr. Keegan was at great pains to say that tax cannot be avoided. It has to be paid somewhere.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: That is what I wanted to discuss. I have read the up-to-date brief. What I gathered from Dr. Keegan's document last week was that criteria existed, the situation depended on whether one was a company or an individual and on whether there were double taxation agreements with specific countries, etc.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: The criteria are clear. Dr. Keegan was at pains to say that, in the case of close companies, trying to use that system to try to avoid paying tax would be punitive.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: I read this document last night, but then I considered Apple. According to page 37, the head office was not tax resident in any country. I do not want to get into the specifics, as I understand the matter is before the courts, but I will ask in a general way as a result of what Dr. Keegan stated. There was a head company, with two companies operating in Ireland - Apple Sales International...

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: From 2014?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: So prior to that, in addition to Apple, any company could have been or was doing this for all we know. Companies could have done exactly what Apple did, namely, not have been resident in any country for the purposes of tax but could have had two branches in Ireland that were only caught for limited amounts here while the vast profits went to a company that was not tax resident anywhere. Our...

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: Dr. Keegan is very good.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: I appreciate that and I do not expect Dr. Keegan to comment. Am I wrong if I say that there could have been 1,000 companies or 100 companies doing that?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: What did it have to do with?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: It could not be looser.

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: I welcome Mr. Cody back. I wish it was the multinationals we had before us but Revenue is the second best in this regard. The context was set during this morning's session and in the Comptroller and Auditor General's chapter, which Revenue knows well, regarding the variation in the collection of corporation tax, with the effective rate ranging from 12.5% to 0%. I am sure Mr. Cody watched...

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: Using that credit legitimately, a number of major companies do not pay corporation tax. How many do not pay tax?

Public Accounts Committee: Comptroller and Auditor General 2016 Report
Chapter 20: Corporation Tax Receipts (Resumed)
(22 Feb 2018)

Catherine Connolly: We know there is variation and we have been led to believe that headlines that say the companies pay nothing are unfair because there are many legitimate reasons they do not. Is that correct?

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