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Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: We published a work programme and it is on that. Was it not on it earlier? I thought last Tuesday's meeting was well notified.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: The work programme will always be in draft form as it is always subject to change.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: No. We will deal with the work programme in a moment. We will hold over the correspondence in connection with Lazard until the next meeting.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Deputy MacSharry is suggesting that we pursue NAMA on making sure we have all the information we request.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Fine. We will return to that at the next meeting because fair points have been raised this morning. The next item is 113B, correspondence received from the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform informing the committee of the appointment of Commissioner John McMahon as chairman and accounting officer of the Office of Public Works. I take this opportunity to thank the outgoing...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Mr. McGuinness will appear before the committee on Wednesday, 16 November. The meeting was intended to take place next Wednesday, 26 October, but Mr. McGuinness will be out of the country at that time. The meeting was rearranged to accommodate his schedule.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Yes.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Do they have to attend a party meeting on a Tuesday?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: The committee decided that in order to avoid interference with our normal Thursday workload, our deliberations on Project Eagle would require additional meetings. Today, we are hearing from officials at the Department of Social Protection and last week we had witnesses from the Revenue Commissioners. Continuing our regular work programme has necessitated having additional meetings on a...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: We are not allowed to meet on Tuesday afternoons because the Dáil is sitting. That is one of the components of Dáil reform. I see the sense in having it Tuesday afternoon but the rules of the House require us to avoid meetings when the Dáil is in plenary session. That forces us to have the meeting in the morning. However, as the Deputy will see from the work programme, that...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Absolutely. Once the public hearings on Project Eagle are out of the way, there should not be too much more in the way of additional meetings.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: We have a rota which runs in sequence.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Yes, the Deputy will be next. We are taking speakers strictly on rota. On a few occasions, however, we have had to seek volunteers. Notwithstanding the rota arrangements, members are always free to say if a particular day does not suit them.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: If a member has a particular interest in attending a meeting, he or she should contact the secretariat to see if it is possible to be accommodated as one of the two opening speakers, subject to agreement by other members. Is there any other business?

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: Deputy Burke is down to speak first and Deputy Connolly second.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: That is appreciated. Such things happen to all of us and traffic is outside of our control. We will suspend for a couple of minutes to allow the witnesses to take their places.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 37 - Department of Social Protection
Chapter 9 - Regularity of Social Welfare Payments
Chapter 10 - Roll-out of the Public Services Card
Social Insurance Fund 2015
(20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: I welcome Ms Niamh O'Donoghue, Secretary General at the Department of Social Protection; Ms Anne Vaughan, deputy Secretary General; Mr. John Conlon, assistant Secretary General; Mr. Jim McDonnell, principal officer; Mr. Tim Duggan, assistant Secretary General; and Ms Kathleen Stack, assistant Secretary General. I also welcome Mr. Colin Menton from the Department of Public Expenditure and...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 37 - Department of Social Protection
Chapter 9 - Regularity of Social Welfare Payments
Chapter 10 - Roll-out of the Public Services Card
Social Insurance Fund 2015
(20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: I thank the Comptroller and Auditor General. On a minor point of clarification, referring to chapter 9, which deals with the farm assist and household benefits schemes, the Comptroller and Auditor General stated the farm assist survey "estimated a level of payments in excess of entitlement of 10.4% of the total amount in payment, which was €88 million in 2015."

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 37 - Department of Social Protection
Chapter 9 - Regularity of Social Welfare Payments
Chapter 10 - Roll-out of the Public Services Card
Social Insurance Fund 2015
(20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: The excess in that case is only €8 million.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 37 - Department of Social Protection
Chapter 9 - Regularity of Social Welfare Payments
Chapter 10 - Roll-out of the Public Services Card
Social Insurance Fund 2015
(20 Oct 2016)

Seán Fleming: The €88 million figure is not the extent of the problem but the total in payment.

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