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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Okay. The first problem for next year is this €400 million or €500 million there will be. The last time Mr. Gloster was before the committee, and the Secretary General had the same view, he said the permanent baseline funding that was necessary even to stand still was €2 billion. I think the HSE got €700 million in the existing level of service, ELS, so there...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: I know there is a one-off.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: That is spread across a number of areas, as Mr. Gloster knows.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: It does not deal with the recurring charge. Of the €1 billion the HSE will get this year in the Revised Estimate, which Mr. Gloster said he is grateful for even though, in my view, it is massively short of what is needed, how much of that will be recurring next year?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: I know. How much of that will be recurring next year?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: The €1 billion.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: The expenditure.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: I understand that. Essentially-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: That will still be the case next year.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: -----as we would be talking about financial risks. Is it still the case, given everything Mr. Gloster said, that there will be a significant deficit again next year?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Okay. I accept that. I will move on to the recruitment embargo because that will have an impact on services towards the end of the year and as we go into next year in what I am sure will be a very busy period not just in emergency departments and hospitals but across all settings. I am looking at the second memo issued to HSE staff. It is interesting that the more we learn about the memo,...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Will all posts that were offered and not accepted be withdrawn?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: I will stop Mr. Gloster there. The memo says "any offers made and not formally accepted, or where a contract has not issued should now be withdrawn".

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: That is not what we are being told by Ministers.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: It is clear from the memo that the only exemptions are consultant appointments, graduate nurses, midwives and doctors in formal approved training programmes. Is every other post subject to this pause?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: That is where some of the confusion will come from. I will deal with the-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: The memo says that the only exemptions are consultant appointments, graduate nurses, midwives and doctors.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Yes, and disability services. I spoke to chief officers who said that home support services are stretched, they cannot take a one-in, one-out approach and they cannot fill vacancies because of this embargo.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Mr. Gloster is now saying that could change.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Winter Preparedness in the Hospital System: Discussion (22 Nov 2023)

David Cullinane: Okay, so home support services are still formally part of the pause.

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