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Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: I presented the figures wrongly, for which I apologise. The company receives €61 million from the Department of Social Protection.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: The figure paid for school transport is €152 million. Is it the case that €16.7 million of this is set aside for administrative costs?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Is school transport a profitable scheme for CIE? Does the company make a profit from the various schemes or does it simply accept payment from different Departments without knowing whether the schemes are profitable?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: We can presume, therefore, that CIE makes a profit.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Last year, PricewaterhouseCoopers flagged issues relating to the accounts of CIE. The response of the Department and CIE was to come together with NewERA to monitor the accounts on a weekly basis. Two major elements of CIE's accounts are the €61 million and €152 paid to the company by the Department of Social Protection and Department of Education and Skills, respectively, for...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Is there not a note in the annual accounts relating to the profitability or otherwise of the two schemes?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: I ask the Comptroller and Auditor General to comment on the matter.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: I presume, as would be the case with any company, that CIE is involved in the schemes in question to make a profit and that the company has a rationale for all its activities.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: One takes what one is given. Surely, however, CIE has the ability to count the number of people who pass through its system and on that basis it could argue with the Government from time to time that it deserves a larger subvention because the number of people availing of the schemes has increased. Likewise, with regard to the Department of Education and Skills, which pays CIE €152...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: As I read these documents, it struck me that the Department of Education and Skills also pays the maintenance costs of some transport vehicles. I ask Mr. O'Mahony to check the position, ascertain the precise figure and provide it to me within the next week. I return to an issue relating to railway carriages which I raised some weeks ago with Mr. Murphy from the National Transport...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: I would like to ask about the payment of €152 million that is made by the Department of Social Protection to CIE in respect of the free pass scheme. What are the figures which support that payment? How is the number of people who carry passes quantified or checked? How is the figure of €152 million arrived at?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: That is the result of effective pressure from public representatives.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: It was agreed with Mr. Murphy that he would provide us with all of that information. We have asked him to link in with the Department and anywhere else necessary in order to make the information given to us comprehensive and full.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: It has not arrived yet.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Not yet.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Was that a David Cameron nudge?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Can we have that information within a week of today's meeting?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Can we publish Mr. O'Mahony's statement?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: I ask Mr. Barry for his opening statement.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 32 - Department of Transport, Tourism and Sport
Chapter 6 - Financial Commitments Under Public Private Partnerships
Chapter 26 - Collection of Motor Taxation
Financial Statements 2011 - National Roads Authority
(7 Feb 2013)

John McGuinness: Can we publish Mr. Barry's statement?

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