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Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Did the university pay above market value for the site?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Surely it is a legitimate question for the Committee of Public Accounts to ask the university. Did it pay the market value or in excess of the market value and have a reason to do so? The university may have had a reason to pay in excess of market value. My question is whether the university believes it paid the correct market value. Part of the problem in answering is that at the time...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: In this hearing I am trying to quantify that decision. What did the decision cost?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Ms Fogarty is talking about valuations after the date. It is a simple question. Does the university believe it paid market value or in excess of it? If it believes it paid in excess, was there a reason for that? The reason I am asking that question is that it is the heart of the issue. A decision was made to purchase a site at a particular value. It is clear and has been fully accepted...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The only iconic thing about this is the breathtaking lack of ability to name the cost of the mistake. It is a simple question. How much did it cost? We accept a mistake was made. We have difficulties around having full public accountability because of legal actions. I accept that. Unfortunately I will not have time to talk about that. There will be an opportunity in the future when the...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The witnesses are talking about value for money rather than the appropriate value of a transaction. They are different things.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: I was going to say that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The university discounts the €3 million valuation.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: What was the value of the site?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The university of Limerick cannot tell us the cost of the mistake or how much it overpaid or underpaid. That is the reality.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: We know that.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: It is breathtaking that at the end of the KPMG process, albeit with the other legal restrictions and so on, that the witnesses come before the Committee of Public Accounts and we are unable to quantify the mistake. If we cannot quantify it, we cannot improve the processes as we go forward.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The absence of that process cost the State money and we cannot identify how much it cost.

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Let us not forget that there are parties not in this room that are preventing the publication of the KPMG report. That is not lost on me. It is why I was frustrated earlier when I asked whether the university believes it paid above the market rate. What was the value? It is important that the KPMG report is locked down. This is an alternative process. We are not bound by any of the...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: I am asking about the report brought to the governing authority recommending the purchase of the site. How was that report prepared and who was involved in preparing it?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: The chief operating officer prepared the report. Was it prepared solely by that office or were other offices in the university involved in preparing that report?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: A significant report with a recommendation was brought to the committee. One would imagine that in preparing any document for the governing authority, multiple offices would have been involved. If there were other offices involved in preparing the report, why did none of them ask the question about the requirement for multiple valuations? If only one office, the office of the chief...

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Was it the case that this project was incredibly positive for Limerick and the university and people got carried away with the positivity and good news of it and the correct questions were not asked or was it the case that misleading information was placed before the governing authority?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: Who was involved in the preparation of the report?

Public Accounts Committee: Financial Statements 2021: University of Limerick (18 May 2023)

Paul McAuliffe: I ask our guests to reflect on that point because an answer would demonstrate the bona fides they say they have. If they are not prepared to say how big the mistake was, we would doubt whether the issue is being taken seriously. Our guests are saying they are taking this seriously but we need to quantify it because our job is to hold public money to account. I ask our guests to help us...

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