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Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: With respect, the knowledge Mr. McDonagh had at that time on 13 March at that meeting was that there was a three-way split that involved Mr. Cushnahan. He had an association with debtors. Mr. McDonagh then says he formed a view that any association with Brown Rudnick and Tughans was when he left. The concern would have been that surely there was a possibility that he had an association...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I am giving Mr. McDonagh my view.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I am just giving my view.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: It is also the view of the minutes.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: It is my clear interpretation of the minutes.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: With respect to the Chairman, I try to be very-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: -----exact and precise in following the logic of minutes. The logic, in my view, overwhelmingly shows that was the case. To add to that, if we turn to page 116 of the Comptroller and Auditor's report-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: Yes.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I will.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I will bring Mr. Daly to page 116 of the Comptroller and Auditor's report, which is the minutes of 11 March 2014. Have we got that up?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: It is the second paragraph after the redacted part where it says "PIMCO advised that the success fee arrangement involved potential payments to three parties, namely Brown Rudnick Solicitors (London) - who had introduced the deal to PIMCO, Tughans Solicitors (Belfast) and Frank Cushnahan, former member of the Northern Ireland Advisory Committee." On 11 March the board knew that Brown Rudnick...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: Yes. So the deal-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: Maybe my understanding of English is different. I will read the full paragraph again because I certainly do not accept that. It is just amazing. It states, "PIMCO advised that the success fee arrangement involved potential payments to three parties, namely Brown Rudnick Solicitors (London) - who had introduced the deal to PIMCO, Tughans Solicitors (Belfast) and Frank Cushnahan, former...

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: If that is not clear, I do not know what is clear.

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: That is standard grammar. I do not-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: What is then-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I am struggling with this. Ms O'Reilly might help me understand it. It says "who had introduced the deal to PIMCO" and Ms O'Reilly says there is a comma after "PIMCO". What is the relevance of Tughans Solicitors and Frank Cushnahan?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: I want to be fair to NAMA but the problem here is we are left with a situation where we have to look at the process and what we perceive potentially to be failures in process. Mr. Daly said earlier that he believed the facts that were set out in the PIMCO letter. The problem is that those facts were not relayed to the board. Was that Mr. Daly's testimony earlier today?

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: Does Mr. Daly believe PIMCO when-----

Public Accounts Committee: Special Report No. 94 of the Comptroller and Auditor General: National Asset Management Agency Sale of Project Eagle (Resumed) (24 Nov 2016)

David Cullinane: Does Mr. Daly believe PIMCO? We disagreed on that but does Mr. Daly believe PIMCO when it says that in April 2013 it was approached by Brown Rudnick and also Tughans and Mr. Cushnahan? Does Mr. Daly believe PIMCO when it says that in its letter?

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