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Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: The point I am making, in a roundabout way, relates to the fact that an institution such as State Street effectively indulged in fraudulent activity and the only penalty it suffered was having to repay the money. For instance, it would have had access to the money for a period. We paid the interest on the money in the form of interest foregone by the NTMA. There must be a penalty to ensure...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: Did anyone lose their job in State Street bank over this?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: Does Mr. Corrigan believe the NTMA now has the corporate structures in place to ensure this will never happen again?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: I will move on to one or two other items. The first item I wish to inquire about is the NTMA's success in raising money on the international markets.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: I do not have access to all the details, but institutions have to take responsibility.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: Ultimately, the NTMA is charged with managing State funds. The question must be asked of whether there was a bonus structure within State Street bank that facilitated and encouraged those individuals to be reckless. The issue for the Committee of Public Accounts is the public purse. They ripped off €3.2 million of taxpayers' money under the radar, so to speak. They have not paid...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: That is still ongoing.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: I return to my original point. Any ordinary person following these proceedings would ask why the witnesses allowed €700 million of taxpayer's money to be put into an organisation for the past two to two and a half years where a matter was under police investigation, and in respect of which PricewaterhouseCoopers was brought in on an independent basis. What fees did that organisation...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: What fees did it earn and what fees would it have earned on an annual basis?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: That is a lot of money.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: Does Mr. Corrigan see the point I am making?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: In the report produced by the UK's financial regulator, there were comments from the staff which clearly showed they were looking to, for want of a better phrase, take the Irish State for a bit of a mug, because they were coming up with concoctions which effectively arose where they took a discount off the sale price. When they returned the sale price, they effectively hid the fees in a...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: I do not want to labour the point but I assume there was nothing new in the information brought up by the UK's financial regulator.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: The witnesses were there.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: If a person was in business and found a person who was selling it a product was ripping off the business and that person had got refunds of money from the business and the owner of the business had reported the incident to both the Garda and to the City of London Police, would it not seem strange to Mr. Corrigan that the one would continue to do business with that person?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: Where does the commission stand now? The organisation made reference to a problem with the fourth transition, which was a previous one. What is the position regarding that transition now?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: August 2012.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: There are no other issues with State Street-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: -----apart from the fact that the City of London Police force is currently with it.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 28 - Accounts of the National Treasury Management Agency
Chapter 29 - Clinical Indemnity Scheme
2012 Annual Report and Accounts - National Pensions Reserve Fund
(13 Feb 2014)

Kieran O'Donnell: In terms moving forward, for an institution such as the NTMA, to what extent have the recommendations put forward by the Comptroller and Auditor General in his report been implemented? If a similar situation were to arise again, have the witnesses any further business association with State Street at this time?

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