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Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: We try to estimate as know the numbers due to retire, but the Army pensions bill increased by 31% between 2007 and 2012. A lot of personnel retired and we could go into all sorts of reason that was the case, but we now see a different motivation for retiring. The private sector is really starting to take off which means that there is competition for talent and people are being headhunted....

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: Yes. As indicated previously to the committee, the ongoing funding of Vote 35 will remain a considerable challenge in future years. The Department of Public Expenditure and Reform is aware of the position, but there are particular difficulties unique to the Defence Forces in predicting retirement and turnover patterns which can contribute to greater than expected expenditure in a given...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: As I outlined in my opening statement, even with additional expenditure on military pensions, the overall group allocation - that is, the two Votes taken together - will not be exceeded in 2015, as there have been savings under Vote 36. The straight answer to the Deputy's question is "No." Essentially, we are funding the extra that we need. We could talk about the formalities of the...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: People will remember that period for all the wrong reasons because there was an effective recruitment ban right across the public sector in an effort to save money. That was not applied to the Defence Forces as rigidly as it was applied elsewhere, because we were allowed to recruit essential staff in terms of skill sets and so on, but it was still a real limitation. If one looks at more...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: I will clarify that. There are minimum service periods before one gets a pension, but they are quite complicated. The mandatory retirement age also depends on rank and when one entered the Defence Forces. If it would be helpful, we could send quite a detailed note to the committee on minimum service age, how one qualifies for a pension and what ranks qualify for what, because we could...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: It depends on rank. The committee will remember that we had a debate on the 21-year soldier issue. That was an example of how complex the mandatory retirement age or period served is. There are issues on fitness tests - when one moves into a certain category, the fitness level and test changes. It is not as simple as saying it is the age of 50, 55, 60 or 65. It is a much more complex set...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: The average age in the Defence Forces is 36; 70% of the Defence Forces are under the age of 40. I am being told that the average retirement age is between 40 and 60. That is a pretty wide margin. I do not want to give the committee an incorrect figure, so we will send the figure to the committee.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: Yes, we will do that. The big problem here is competition for talent. The numbers leaving the Defence Forces are in one way a compliment to the standards in the Defence Forces in terms of levels of training. Some people may try to spin that and say that people are leaving because they are unhappy in the Defence Forces. One could also say that people are leaving because they are being...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: That is not a huge issue.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: There were 97 at the start of the year and we think there are fewer than 90 now.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: No.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: We have active recruitment campaigns under way all the time. There may be lots of people who want to join but that does not mean that they meet the standards. For example, we have a really active recruitment effort to recruit more women to the Defence Forces. Only 6.2% of the Defence Forces are women. That is not acceptable to me in a modern defence force infrastructure and with many of...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: What is happening-----

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: Without raising expectations too much, we are looking at trying to do something for that group of people next year given the year that is in it. We will announce that at a later stage.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: The last veteran died in 2006, so these are widows.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: Absolutely.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: I am told they have different pensions and it also depends on the time of the year in which the pensioner may have passed away, so I do not want to be too crude about that. The actual figure is about 90 from 97, so it is seven fewer, not five. This is about widows of deceased military service pensioners. It is also about widows of special allowance holders and widows of service medal...

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: By the way, it is 103 just in case anybody wants to feel good about themselves.

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: Is that under appropriations-in-aid?

Select Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 35 - Army Pensions (Supplementary)
(25 Nov 2015)

Simon Coveney: We have estimated that correctly, so that is bang on €5.4 million.

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