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Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I thank the Cathaoirleach and members for the invitation to attend today to present the 2022 Supplementary Estimate for the Department of Social Protection. I am seeking a Supplementary Estimate of €722 million for 2022 and the purpose of this Supplementary Estimate is to address a shortfall in funding for my Department, which is required because of three main drivers of additional...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I thank the Deputy. Budget 2023 expanded the fuel allowance to the over 70s. That was something I was keen to address because the last thing we want to see is old people who are more vulnerable to the cold afraid to turn on the heating. We wanted to increase the number of people who benefited from the fuel allowance. A single person over 70 who earns up to €500 and a couple who...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I thank the Deputy for raising those important issues. The fuel allowance for the over 70s is designed for a couple. Issues around the community welfare service have been raised and I will update the committee in that regard. The additional needs payment is the overarching term used to refer to exceptional and urgent needs. The purpose of these payments is to assist people with...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I thank Deputy Ó Cuív for raising a number of issues. Regarding the capital disregards, as the Deputy knows, I made some changes in respect of carers and over-70s for the fuel allowance. I have made a good few changes over the last couple of budgets. I would love to do everything but I cannot do that in one budget. I agree with the Deputy in terms of people who are profoundly...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: If Deputy Donnelly provides me or my officials with the details of the case, I will be happy to follow it up. When I get hard evidence I can go back and say exactly what is happening. It is not as easy to make a case with anecdotal evidence. I ask the Deputy to give me the details of the case and we will follow it up. We will make sure to get answer. As the Deputy said, an answer is...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I thank the Deputy for his questions. I will give him the figures for the Ukrainians. As of 7 November, PPS numbers had been issued to 62,741 people from Ukraine. Income supports are being paid in respect of 45,817 people including 2,171 adult dependants and 15,194 child dependants. Child benefit is now also being paid in respect of 16,000 children and the total social protection...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: When I am doing this review I will look at the detailed costings. The figure I have at the minute is €50 million, but I think when we-----

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: It is €50 million for the means assessment of capital for the first €50,000 to be exempt. Breaking it down, €20,000 should be assessed at €10 a week, €10,000 and the balance at €20 per week. The Department looked at that using that formula for calculating capital means. A disability allowance applicant with €150,000 in savings and no...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I agree with the Deputy on that because more people are in the workforce now than ever before. On the partial capacity benefit, the cost of the lump sum payment of €500 would be €1.6 million, and there are about 3,200 people on the scheme.

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: They all add up. That is my problem.

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: May I come back in on the school lunches?

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I am very committed to that programme, as Deputy Ó Cuív will know. It has been expanded, and 270,000 or maybe more children avail of the school meals programme now. I want to ramp up the hot school meals programme. I am also conscious that the cost of food has gone up. The suppliers get €2.90 per hot meal. That is the rate at the minute. There is an evaluation, however,...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: If it is resolved, it is resolved, but if the Deputy still wants to give me the details-----

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: Then you wonder why you should have to go around the mountain. If the Deputy wants to give me the details, I am happy to look at the case so maybe we can make some tweaks to some things. That said, if you make a tweak for one thing, you can have a whole platter of stuff on your plate you did not realise was coming.

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: The carer's allowance is part of the supports that provide payments on the basis of income need. The means test plays a critical role in determining whether an income need arises as a consequence of a particular contingency, be that illness, disability, employment or caring. The disregards relating to the means test for carer's allowance are among the highest in the social protection...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: The legislation is in the budget-----

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: Of the administration overspend, €11.5 million is going on pay, which covers the cost of increases in 2022 due under the Building Momentum public service agreement. There also has been an increase in the use of overtime to meet the additional demands on the Department's community welfare service arising from the cost-of-living crisis and the Ukraine crisis and to deal with significant...

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: Yes. There is a lot of it made up of that.

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: Yes. I might come back to the Chair. The administration expenses on the SIF are apportioned between the Vote and the SIF schemes. PUP is a SIF scheme but the numbers on the scheme were much higher than envisaged in the original Estimate. There are also much higher numbers of the Covid illness benefit. That is part of the reason for the overspend on the administration side. Am I making sense?

Select Committee on Social Protection: Estimates for Public Services 2022
Vote 37 - Social Protection (Supplementary)
(23 Nov 2022)

Heather Humphreys: I am not making sense. To which subhead is the Chair referring?

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