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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: I am very anxious-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: I am getting responses that do not answer the questions. I have seen Ms Graham's argument put forward many times, so it need not be repeated. Can she tell me how much of the €40 million Bus Éireann subsidy relates to services provided in the urban areas of Galway, Limerick, Waterford and Cork?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Would Ms Graham be able to give me those figures?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Am I right in thinking Bus Éireann's fare structure for those urban areas is totally different from the fare structure for the rural services of Bus Éireann?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Those fares tend to be much lower per mile, even though the distances are shorter.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: However, per mile, kilometre, metre or however it is measured, the fares tend to be much lower.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: In policy terms, on what objective, not historic, basis does the NTA determine fare structures?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: I have one final question.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Could Ms Graham forward to the committee the NTA's high-level goals as to where it would like to see its fare structure in, say, ten years' time and the objective basis on which it would like to see that fare structure based?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Senator Hopkins can go ahead.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: This has been a fascinating day. Would it assist the National Transport Authority and the three companies represented here if full cost recovery was provided for on the services provided for people with social welfare cards?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Will Ms Graham provide the committee with a breakdown of the figures for the three companies, showing the percentage of the real fare the Department of Social Protection pays to each of them?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Yes, I am asking for general rather than specific figures, for example, 30% or 40%.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: That would be very useful. We have heard a great deal about commercial services. This is a major philosophical issue. When CIE was founded in the 1930s, private services were operating all over the place. The system was found to be chaotic and unplanned and it was decided to bring services under one roof, with profitable services subsidising unprofitable ones. The idea was that we would...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Who made the decision?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Who asked Bus Éireann to make that decision? Was it the Department of Transport at the time?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: Was a similar decision made in respect of Bus Átha Cliath?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: What Ms Graham is telling me is that it was possible, under the same European Union regulation and the same national law, to have one service provided on a total network basis and another provided on the basis of a self-declaration by a company on which services were commercial and which were subject to a public service obligation. In so doing the company discommoded itself by placing itself...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: One or other of the two systems is the appropriate one.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Arts, Heritage, Regional, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs: Sustaining Viable Rural Communities: Discussion (Resumed) (1 Feb 2017)

Éamon Ó Cuív: I would describe the position as "an aisteach", but we will move on because the Chairman wants me to do so. Is it within the power of the National Transport Authority to insist on all licensed carriers accepting the free travel pass?

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