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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: It is a zero sum game if the claimant only received the figure he or she would have received in any event. If he or she managed to get a better figure because he or she engaged with the legal system, that is his or her right. Nobody is saying it is not. However, if he or she is going to settle with an insurance company for €4,000 but goes off to the solicitor and is told he or she...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I am not saying they do, I am not saying they do not. I do not know. However, there is an issue there in that it is a settlement that has not gone to court, yet it involves a potentially significant amount of legal costs and we do not have any data on that either.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I move on to my last question, which I have asked of everybody else at this stage. Mr. Murphy might have seen me asking two previous witnesses. If the witnesses were sitting here in the committee when Insurance Ireland come before us, as I think they are to do on Thursday-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: You can sit in the Visitors Gallery but you probably cannot sit here. What questions would you like the committee to ask Insurance Ireland? We have probably covered them already.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: It could not admit that even if it was.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Thank you. I have the same question for Mr. McGarry on behalf of the Bar Council.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: These are things that we heard this morning. I had not been familiar with that concept until this morning and I am sure many others were not. Perhaps it only ever happened once. Certainly, it was asserted that it was-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The assertion was made this morning and the committee needs to tease it out.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I thank the witnesses for their contributions.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Apologies have been received from Deputy Sean Sherlock. I remind members and witnesses to ensure their mobile phones are switched off. This is important as they cause serious problems for broadcasting, editorial and sound staff. This is session A on the rising cost of motor insurance. We will meet representatives of the Injuries Board and the Society of Actuaries in Ireland. I welcome Mr....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Mr. Dunne will make a submission on behalf of the Society of Actuaries in Ireland.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I thank Mr. O'Brien and Mr. Dunne for their opening statements, which were sent to allow us to consider them in advance of the meeting this morning. Clearly, both witnesses' organisations are very informed as to what is going on within the insurance industry, particularly motor insurance. A number of members have indicated that they wish to put questions. Generally, we allow each member to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I will ask Mr. Dunne to come in first.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We were told by one person last week that there are 22 players in the Irish motor insurance industry and by somebody else that there are five main players. If you agree that there are five main players, they are nearly all multinationals with operations in both Ireland and the UK. Is that correct?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: They have the IT and central services somewhere that have done this type of work for the UK already.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We cannot be very different in terms of our market, laws, legal system and so forth.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Is the society a member of the Minister of State's working group or has it made a submission to it?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: On Senator Conway-Walsh's question regarding a symbiotic relationship with the industry, obviously our guests are professional people who have qualifications and so forth. Most people understand the profession and consider it very important. Are most actuaries employed by insurance companies or are many of them working on their own behalf as consultants? What is the breakdown in that...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: It would be fair to say that many actuaries are not employed by and on the payrolls of insurance companies, and certainly not motor insurance companies.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (14 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Thank you. Will Conor O'Brien address the questions?

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