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Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. I just want to conclude with this matter ... sorry, yes, sure, Mr. Gormley.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay, we might come back. Just, finally, I want to deal with two other matters. And if the whole story was a movie, the two big scenes in it would be the night of the guarantee and the entry into the bailout programme, but life isn't like that. It doesn't have big moments, it's a series of events that maybe have significant events actually through it. So can I maybe ... this is a question...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Did the structure or design of the bank guarantee, along with its period of duration, have any bearing on the Irish State entering a bailout programme two years and two months after the bank guarantee?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: With respect, Mr. Gormley, that's not the question I asked you-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: The guarantee was predicated on the fact-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: I'm not questioning the ... how the guarantee was arrived at, or anything like that, and I'm not raising issues as to what were the options on the night, but a guarantee of a specific design was put in place.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: That is a fact. The reasons and motivations for this we can continue to examine, and why it shaped the way it was, we can continue to examine. But a particular shape was put in place, and the question simply, Mr. Gormley, and I'll come to Ms Harney on this, is: did that have any bearing in the way it was shaped to the country entering a bailout programme two years and two months? Because...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Yes, indeed.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: What I want to deal with, Mr. Gormley, is the period after the guarantee, not the period leading up to ... the guarantee was put in place; that was a fact. Can you just - either it had a relationship to entering the bailout programme later on, or it hadn't. Maybe it's more nuanced than that, you can explain that.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: The reason why I'm challenging on this is because Mr. Trichet, in his testimony before this inquiry, would relate to that theory and Mr. Trichet's testimony must be tested-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: -----as must be every other person's testimony. Mr. Trichet is saying, when he came before ... when we met him in Kilmainham, he says, "[As] you know, we could [...] have continued on our side [...] having gone up to 100% of GDP [...] to 200% of GDP, [This is all the liquidity that was going into the banks after the guarantee] and why not 300% of GDP? [I can't do the French accent, so I'll...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. Ms. Harney?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. Just one final thing, just to clear up with Ms Harney. Earlier you said that the banks were insolvent, to your view. Did you say that?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Only for Anglo, okay. And when did you become aware that Anglo was insolvent?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Which was?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: All right. Thank you. I now propose that we take a break for about six minutes. And, in doing so, just to let the witnesses know that they're still under oath, that they can consult with their ... whatever support or legal advices that they have with ... there, and that we resume at 5.00 p.m. Is that agreed? Agreed.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay. With members' permission so, we'll go back into public session and continue our engagement with Mr. Gormley and Ms Harney. Is that agreed? And, in doing so, can I invite Deputy Kieran O'Donnell. Deputy, you've six minutes.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Freudian slip there.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (29 Jul 2015)

Ciarán Lynch: Okay, thank you very much. Next questioner is Senator Michael D'Arcy. Senator?

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