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Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I am not asking Ms Browne for information about leases or what is contained in them. I am asking her for the position regarding negotiations on lease category A. Ms Browne need not specify the Department or anything else. I want to know how long Ms Browne's section has been in negotiations on various leases before it.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: No, I am not asking for any reason. I am asking how many leases the office has been dealing with for 12 months, for two years and so on. The information we have received suggests there are people who occupy properties and who are attempting to resolve their leasing issues with the State. We are told it is a matter for the office. I have no wish to find out the names or anything else. I...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I did not.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: There were a number of them, so it could be anyone.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I understand that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: That is fine, but Ms Creedon might simply tell me in order that I know. It is frustrating dealing with Departments.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: The question of commercial sensitivity and the possibility of legal action is nonsense in some cases. I am asking for general information in order that I can understand where the blockages are when it comes to the delivery of these leases. It is easy to say that for category A, the number of leases is five, the cases have gone on for five years and the reasons are mainly to do with those...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: That is all we are asking for. It is general information.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I have another question on leases. It may be historical but it relates to where leases have been created with no break clause, thus tying the State to millions of euro in terms of its responsibility in the context of the lease. For example, let us suppose a lease is created for 60 years, or whatever it may be, with no break clause. Regardless of what changes take place in the course of...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: This is an interesting point. I am sure that on the side of the Chief State Solicitor's office there is considerable intelligence about the law, how it can be applied, the implications of applying it, the responsibilities of Departments and so on. Surely if the office received a suggestion from a Department that a given lease should be for 60 years or 20 years without a break clause or a...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: We are talking about commercial situations where property is leased by the State. The best thing we can do is get the examples. Some of them will be specific examples. We will send them to Ms Creedon because they are of concern to me, as a member of this committee? Rather than dance around the general issue, we should get specific examples and give them to the Chief State Solicitor's...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: The HSE does its own thing. Is that correct? The HSE does not do it very well.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: My understanding, Mr. Donoghue, is that the Director of Public Prosecutions will give that reply.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: Is that since 2008?

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I will follow on from what Deputy Costello has said. I am aware of a case that has been raised in this House. I am not going to mention it, although there has been plenty of public comment on same. A young man was killed and the family of that young man wrote to the Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions asking for explanations. The complaint was not just that the family were...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: In this particular case, one of the questions that was asked was why the State had a junior counsel on the case while the other side was provided with legal services from the State-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: -----free legal aid and had a senior counsel, a junior counsel and a solicitor. I am working from memory. There were other issues regarding that case involving information in the Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions and so on. The family were less than satisfied and they continue to campaign on the basis that the decision has not been explained to them. I have raised the matter...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I am not asking the deputy director to comment.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I am going to ask the lady concerned to set out everything one more time. I will possibly send the deputy director the file that I have, and he might reply to her, just to see how far that reply extends and as a test case.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 3: Office of the Attorney General
Vote 5: Office of the Director of Public Prosecutions
Vote 6: Office of the Chief State Solicitor
(12 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I have not asked the Deputy Director to do that here.

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