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Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Yes, it is correct.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: All politics is local.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: There has been a long series of interventions. Senator Twomey, who moved the amendment, inquired into the nature of the business plan. The interim business plan that was discussed is simply an interim draft plan. The final plan, which will be a ten-year plan, will have to be approved by the board of the agency when it is appointed. The interim business plan is a draft and an indication of...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Senator Callely raised a number of specific questions which are important. Like Senator Burke, he is also reflecting, not so much on what builders and developers are saying as builders and developers but on what they are saying as customers of financial institutions. As Senator Butler correctly stated, NAMA does not yet exist. It has assumed an existence in the public mind which it does...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: -----amount to something and not amount to something with great ease. I have always followed the maxim in regard to banks that cash is king. If one can find out where the cash is, one will generally find the answers. Senator Butler made a point on the entity. It is the case that NAMA has a commercial mandate. That must be the case, as that is how we protect the taxpayer. Senator...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: -----in that sort of soft Connacht voice of his. "Would you not be sorry for the poor man who is outside the gate this evening?" He is a master at that. I have seen him at it all his life, so it is not a new-trick pony to me.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I see. There you are. Obviously there are things he taught Senator Leyden that he did not teach me. It has been a very good debate-----

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: Yes. We have receipts on foot of the guarantee scheme. The Senator also inquired about possible assistance from the Office of Public Works. We are open to that. That office has some specialities that could be of considerable assistance.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: May I make a point of order?

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I think amendment No. 7 is grouped with another amendment.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I agreed in the Lower House to advertise for the board of NAMA and I have received 500 applications to date. I will examine Senator MacSharry's suggestion, which might be appropriate in this context. On the merits of this amendment, a great deal has been inserted into the legislation to ensure that this body is far more transparent and accountable than any other body we have established....

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I am encouraged by that because it represents a change in the attitude of both Houses towards corporate governance. In the past decade the attitude has been that one can set up an agency, divorce it from the Government, prescribe a corporate governance standard for it and leave it entirely apart from the political system, because the political system is presumptively wicked in its intentions...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: -----to note that it appears to be an all-party drift away from it. I was struck when the Bill was introduced by the amount of criticism to the effect that the Minister has too much power and how that vanished during the debates. There is a high degree of transparency in the legislation. The National Treasury Management Agency is exempt from the Freedom of Information Act. Senator Alex...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: If the bulk of the information is commercially sensitive, being obliged to prove that in individual cases will, of course, constitute an administrative burden. Virtually all of the information at the disposal of the agency will, in any event, be exempt.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: That is correct.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: There have been many contributions on this amendment. Senator O'Toole introduced the concept of the distribution of assets in specie. I should eliminate that from the debate before dealing with the amendments' merits. Senator O'Toole is of course quite right.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: I said I was going to eliminate him before I addressed the merits of the amendment. As Senator O'Toole rightly pointed out, section 12(2)(h) creates a specific power in NAMA to distribute assets in specie to the Minister. I am grateful to Senator MacSharry for providing a good translation of the term; its colloquial meaning is "as is". Senator O'Toole was quite correct on the provenance of...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: This section enables NAMA during the termination of its existence to transfer these assets in specie to the Minister. The Minister will hardly put the racehorse into the Exchequer but can decide what to do with it. That is the provenance of this particular power and has nothing to do with social purpose or a social dividend.

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: That was the issue Senator O'Toole raised. I am grateful to him for raising this interesting question about the provision. The Labour Party's amendment provides for making appropriate assets available for public, community or social use, either free or at a non-commercial cost, or transferring assets to appropriate statutory agencies to facilitate such use. Senator Mullen's amendment is...

Seanad: National Asset Management Agency Bill 2009: Report and Final Stages (11 Nov 2009)

Brian Lenihan Jnr: They still have to pay market value. Market values have fallen, but they will not be required to pay the ransom values which we witnessed in connection with some sites in recent years. That will be a substantial advance.

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