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Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: I welcome Mr. O'Brien, his officials and Ms Buckley. I thank them for attending what is probably the last day of our analysis of the various public sector allowances across the Departments and agencies. There were two striking items in Mr. O'Brien's opening statement. He stated: "Due to the challenges posed by the legacy payroll systems predating the HSE, it has been difficult to quantify...

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: When Mr. Tony O'Brien says in his opening statement that he is unable to quantify with precision the exact number of staff and costs, does that include directly employed staff or does it only refer to staff in the voluntary sector?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Does that refer to staff in the voluntary sector?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Are there approximately 36,670 staff in the voluntary sector in 2011?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: So just over half of those the HSE directly employs work in the voluntary sector.

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Yes, and there are 36,670 in the voluntary sector. What is the position with that review and when does the witness expect to submit it to the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Are the allowances that the voluntary sector receives similar to the allowances directly paid?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: The second thing that was striking in the opening statement was the clarification of the difference between the amount for allowances in Vote 40 versus the amount in the review. Mr. Tony O'Brien pointed out that the Department of Health consolidated pay scales classify seasonal payments and on-call payments as allowances but that the DPER review did not, or, with the agreement of the DPER,...

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: I take Ms Buckley's point. At this committee, we have already discussed the many allowances submitted that most people acknowledge are core pay. It would have been helpful to have submitted the full breadth of allowances, as other Departments have done, and I am unsure why they have been excluded. It seems at odds with how other Departments have interpreted the review. It is possibly...

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: I do.

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: I accept that point and no one wants to risk patient safety. At the same time, our remit is to try to get as great an overview of all payments beyond core pay and to delve into a discussion of whether certain allowances should be core pay. We have had good discussions on that. Who receives on-call payments?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Do consultants receive them?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Does Mr. O'Brien have figures for the cost of on-call payments in the HSE in 2011?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: That would be very useful. It would be particularly useful if we could have the figures broken down by grade in terms of how much is paid for nurses on-call and consultants. Much of our discussion at the many committee meetings Ms Buckley has attended concern where allowances are going. In many areas, the allowances go to relatively low paid employees. One may have a concern about the...

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Perhaps Mr. O'Brien can go through 20 of the 41 allowances for which no business case was submitted. The table supplied by Mr. O'Brien has been colour-coded, with red for allowances abolished for new beneficiaries, orange for allowances approved for new beneficiaries subject to further review, and green referring to allowances approved for new beneficiaries. The green and the orange...

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: We are drowning in tables.

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Are the allowances the HSE wishes to abolish for new beneficiaries those from No. 17 to No. 37?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: The table is a little confusing. Can the witnesses clarify the level of overtime costs in HSE? How much is the average overtime bill? How much was the overtime bill in 2011?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: We have discussed absenteeism at the HSE on a number of occasions. How much of the overtime bill of €169,857 relates to medical demand?

Public Accounts Committee: Health Service Executive - Review of Allowances (8 Nov 2012)

Simon Harris: Absolutely. I accept the point on front-line services but do we have a breakdown on how much of the overtime bill is derived from absenteeism, albeit on the front line?

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