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Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Okay. Can I ask you on page 6 of your statement you make reference to that in 2005, EBS went from a situation where they were not in the land and development lending to over a two-year period to go really from zero to €1.7 billion. And the question I want to ask you is: if EBS had not gone into the land and development lending, would EBS have required a bailout from the taxpayer?...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: At the time that NAMA arose, what was the level of what I would regard as development loans in EBS at that time?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Of what?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: So the €1.7 billion you speak about-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Was total of the two, but some of that would have ended up ... so there would have been €1.7 billion of loans available for transfer to NAMA.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Okay.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: So we're up at nearly a million.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: A billion.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Yes.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: I suppose the question I have-----

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: You would not have been going into NAMA?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: As an organisation. So in your view was the ... two quick questions. Number one; why did EBS enter the market when clearly it was a profitable company, profitable business prior to that? And why did it go in after the land and development business? Did it have the requisite expertise? You spoke already about risk assessment. And do you believe at the time, for the organisation, that it...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: So, I suppose, I have one more question now, I should ask, would EBS be stand-alone today if it hadn't gone into the development side in 2005?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Can I refer you to Vol. 2, page 161, and, Chairman, it's, it's EBS board presentation 26 September - "Government intervention anticipated and unavoidable". And I want to read just one, one paragraph, "Government intervention anticipated and unavoidable; potential scale of intervention is likely to be considerable and could change the Irish banking landscape here fundamentally." That's a...

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: And, can you just give me the basis for that statement because that statement was made, basically, three days before the guarantee was put in place?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: Anglo and Irish Nationwide.

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: And how long would it have been in the public ether that those two organisations were in ... were in trouble?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: And, two quick questions. Did you regard either institution as to be systemic to the Irish banking system and did you, as CEO of EBS, in any way approach the Central Bank, Financial Regulator, Department of Finance, Government sources to express your concerns? And, did you see in any way that they could impact on EBS, your own institution, in terms of, of its activities?

Committee of Inquiry into the Banking Crisis: Nexus Phase (22 Jul 2015)

Kieran O'Donnell: And you wouldn't have seen any-----

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