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Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: It is incredible.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: Under Mr. Ó Cualáin's stewardship, were all the materials Mr. Kelly requested delivered promptly?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: It did not meet the C&AG requirements on the reporting structure for that year because of the length of time it took, which is unfortunate. Did the Commissioner ever raise any issues of company or ethics law in relation to the witnesses' activities? I will start with Ms McMahon. Did any Commissioner ever raise issues of company or ethics law in any way with any of the witnesses?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: No Commissioner ever raised company law issues, the fact the Garda should not be directors, should not own land and that there should be SIPO declarations. Were those issues ever raised with anyone by any Commissioner?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I understand that. Mr. McGee was in the C&AG's office before he went to the Garda. Is that correct?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: We do our research at this end. Mr. Barrett told the committee he regards Mr. McGee as a good accountant and that he did his work well. The report he did is a good report and we all accept that. Nine years have passed since. Did Mr. McGee not feel obliged in the interim, before this came to the internal auditor in March 2016, that under a Civil Service code of ethics, for want of a better...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: It was a good piece of work.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I understand that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: That is very honest. This is nothing personal.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I appreciate Mr. McGee's answer. He is a person who did his work diligently and well.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: If Mr. McGee had his time again and nothing had happened, would he have acted differently?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: Does Mr. McGee not feel it was an organisation within an organisation? Essentially, Mr. McGee did a report, which is a very good report. He pushed it up the line to Mr. Culhane and nothing transpired for years. Did he not feel, given his role and under the legislation that he should do something? Mr. McGee is well aware of all the issues because there is huge similarity between his report...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I understand but did Mr. McGee ever suggest it to Mr. Culhane?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: My point is very simple. If Mr. McGee had his time again, does he feel he would have acted differently? Six, seven and eight years passed and nothing happened. Mr. McGee knew what was going on here. He knew the structures that were in place. He wrote the report. He was working in an organisation where the structures around accountancy procedures and management of funds simply did not...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: Everyone has the authority to make a decision on disclosure. Everyone has the authority. I have the authority myself. It is a decision for me. No one could stop Mr. McGee taking an action; it is up to him to do it. Was it just he felt it would be extremely difficult for him to do it within An Garda Síochána?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: The CAO did not deal with it either.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I appreciate that. I am not having a go at Mr. McGee.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I respect Mr. McGee. He did a good report.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: I know that. There comes a time if something does not happen with the best will in the world that one has to go further. I was hoping Mr. McGee would say that if he had the time back again, he would have done something different but obviously he will not say that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 20 - Garda Síochána - Internal Audit Report on Garda College, Templemore (Resumed)
(14 Jun 2017)

Alan Kelly: Why? I do not understand that. Why would it compromise Mr. McGee?

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