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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Review of Out-of-School Provision Report and Education and Supports Provision for Ukrainian Students: Discussion (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: We need to be very clear here. Deputy Pádraig O'Sullivan already acknowledged that considerable supports have been provided by the Department of Education. Throughout the Covid pandemic teaching hours and financial supports have been made available. The priority here is to ensure cohesion of delivery and a mechanism of funding. There needs to be cohesion of governance across these...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Review of Out-of-School Provision Report and Education and Supports Provision for Ukrainian Students: Discussion (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I have already received an invitation from the centre. I will do all that I can to see if I can fulfil that. I was very pleased to meet some of the students here. They also extended an invitation. I will do all that I can.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: Provision for the younger children will come under the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth. The Senator mentioned language. More than 918 schools requested additional support relating to English as an additional language or additional teaching hours and that has been granted. We are also considering the live issue of tutors to teach English to speakers of...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: As I said in my opening remarks, I concur that excellent work has been done, and continues to be done, by our schools. The Deputy clearly articulated the situation when he said they have come out of the challenges of the pandemic and moved into a new challenge. It has been my good fortune to have had the opportunity to visit many schools and see all of the work going on seamlessly and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I thank the Deputy. As I referenced earlier, we have a clear understanding of where we have capacity within our schools. It was for that reason I said in reply to Deputy Ó Ríordáin that we are working closely with the Department of Children, Equality Disability, Integration and Youth. It would be very helpful if we could match accommodation with our capacity. It is very hard...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I referenced that more than 918 of our schools applied for additional hours under English as an additional language teaching posts, which were granted. We also have the ESOL tutors. These are tutors who make themselves available, and will do so throughout the summer, particularly to adults but also to our post-primary students. We also have initiatives in our schools, for example, the Say...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: That is a very good point because they will very much enhance provision. We have reached out to those who have teaching qualifications and teaching backgrounds. We have invited them to register with the Teaching Council. A number have already done so. The numbers are small at this point, which is understandable, for a variety of reasons. Some 48 or 49 people have currently registered...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: On future projected numbers, I reiterate we are clear of our capacity in having a potential 25,000 places at primary school and 20,000 at post-primary. REALT, which has been an invaluable resource to us, and I acknowledge the work of the 16 ETBs in leading that, is liaising very closely with the planning and building unit to manage our projected enrolments. References were made to families...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: That is a fair point on the Ukrainian exams. The Ukrainian equivalent of our leaving certificate, the matura, has been cancelled this year. It is not running. It did not run last year or the previous year either because of Covid. The students were given a type of school completion certificate, or a version of that. They recently confirmed this is their intention this year as well. I want...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I will give the answers in writing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: The Deputy asked about the engagements we have had on behalf of Ukrainian students and I can confirm that initiatives are under way with the Ukrainian ministry, the EU and UNESCO. We are also looking at what is happening in other jurisdictions. We already have considerable experience ourselves of dealing with students coming from different educational backgrounds and systems, albeit not at...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: As I said, we have engaged with the Ukrainian department of education. The Ukrainian mature exam, which is the equivalent of our leaving certificate, was cancelled this year and in the previous two years because of Covid and students are getting a certificate of completion. In terms of third level, there is an online university entrance exam and, as I understand it, the Department of...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: We have also made other provisions in terms of accessibility for the schools. Rather than responsibility for summer provision being undertaken by school principals, there will now be an overseer role as well, which means another individual can take responsibility for it. There will be, for the first time, an online payment made available for staff working on the summer provision programme....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I thank Senator Dolan. In reference to the two points she raised, the REALTs have been an invaluable source for working through and finding pathways forward for us in this current situation. I acknowledge their effectiveness and the manner in which they are operating. There are 16 REALTS operating out of the ETBs, with a variety of supports, whether it is NEPS or the linking in with...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: As we have already said, considerable resources have been put in place in schools for intensive English as an additional language, EAL. More than 918 of our schools have applied for additional resources there either in terms of EAL hours or additional teaching hours. As I referenced, we have the English to speakers of other languages, ESOL, tutors coming on stream, specifically working with...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: The Deputy asked the number of students who have not presented to schools and it is our understanding approximately a third of students are in this category for a variety of reasons. It is important for us to allow the children and families to make that judgment call and to suit themselves.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: Children may initially have a reluctance to attend but may see others settling into school. We are very happy to go at the pace that best suits the individual child. We estimate the figure to be in or around a third of the total. That may include older students.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: No, it is a third of all children. These could include those aged 18 or so and moved to some other type of education experience or work. Their education might be finished. I referenced students presenting for exams earlier and the facility is being made available for students who wish to follow the Ukrainian education curriculum. It is interesting to note that although many choose to do...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: Absolutely. We are working very closely with the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth on this, as I mentioned. There is a clarity from our perspective about where we have clear capacity. It is totally understandable that the Department of Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth has a priority for the families to have accommodation. It is our...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills: Provision of Education Supports for Ukrainian Students (1 Jun 2022)

Norma Foley: I understand it is approximately 1,000. I do not have the full breakdown. As I said, it is interesting to note that they are availing of both, including online. There is an awareness also that for the past three years, there has not been a Ukrainian leaving certificate senior exam. They are mindful of that and are availing of the Irish system too.

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