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Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I did not know that.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I am happy to hear that. I did not get that from the Minister's earlier-----

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: We have not discussed this at all.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: We will discuss it as we go through the subheads. That is fine.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: This is more of an observation. I will not go back over the previous discussion but the Estimate last year for this Vote was €362 million. The Minister brought in a Supplementary Estimate in December for another €22 million because it is hard to predict the numbers. We are told the outturn was €368 million which meant the Minister required an additional €7...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I have not finished. I am reading the Minister's statement.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: To be very clear, and I am not being awkward, we will be very prompt as we go along but I never agreed to a ten minute slot for anything. It was not discussed with us. We will get through the business very promptly. We will fly through some of the other subheads. We might take another few minutes here but I will not be caught by a ten minute limit. I do not think the Minister would be...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: The Minister has €25 million in this year's Estimate.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I accept that.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: Amazing.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I have questions on subheads A8 and A9. Perhaps the Minister will supply a detailed note to the committee on these subheads. The Estimates never before provided a figure for liabilities under Chapter 2C of the Taxes Consolidation Act 1997. Although nobody can predict the ultimate figure, the estimated figure is €1 million. The Act places joint liability for taxes due on the...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: Does the money have to be remitted to Revenue in the meantime? Essentially it will be clawed back over the lifetime of the pensioner.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: A cheque will have to be sent to Revenue.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: Send it to us.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I understand the concept and would like to study it in detail.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: On subhead A9, I would estimate there would be 1,500 people on pensions of €33,000. How many people are covered by that provision?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: We are so used to speaking about millions or billions of euro that when I saw the figure of 55, I took it to be €55 million but it is only €55,000. It is a long time since we have discussed thousands in this committee. We aim too high.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: I note that the State Laboratory is taking on the work of carrying out tests on behalf of coroners which was previously done in Beaumont Hospital. It is also assisting in the testing of a drug for horses and testing for petrol stretching. I hope the latter work will lead to prosecutions. In regard to the testing carried out for coroners, I ask for further information on the timescale....

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: It is interesting.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Public Expenditure and Reform: Estimates for Public Services 2015
Vote 11 - Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 16 - Valuation Office (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - Shared Services (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
(11 Feb 2015)

Seán Fleming: The Minister has the gist of my questions.

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