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Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Was there travel involved in the work?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Can we find out for completeness?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Quite a lot of information on CIT was sent to me as Chairman of the committee which I will make available to members and the Department. It is too detailed to go through here and in any event, it would be unfair to ask questions, given that the Department is not aware of it. I will have it passed on and the Department might provide a general comment in response.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: I want to ask about the school transport scheme, about which I have asked before and many articles have been written. While I do not expect the Department to comment on any of the legal aspects of the scheme, it is worrying to see so much being written about it. I am anxious to know from a public accounts point of view whether the Department has the necessary oversight of the millions the...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: The procurement.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: No; I am asking about the Department's oversight of the lump of money that goes into Bus Éireann.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Yes. I am referring to what we have been reading in the newspapers. It is about Bus Éireann procuring individuals or companies to provide transport.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: That is why we will not get into it here.

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Is putting it out to tender an option?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Thank you. While it is a complex area in terms of the transport that is provided, it is not so complex that the Department could not put together some sort of tender arrangement whereby it would at least ask the market. Everyone, whether in business or Departments, is being encouraged to ask for a number of tenders. Given that of all the issues are being discussed in the media and...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Is that a new arrangement?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Does Mr. McCarthy know he has that job?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: I commend the Department on this because there are many other examples of money going into the system. Mr. Burke has been open with us about the complex nature of it and Mr. Ó Foghlú has also been open with us about change. It is no harm that this would happen and it is good for it to happen by agreement. My last question is on residential institutions redress. The Department...

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Historically, the Department funded various service organisations. How did the organisations account for that funding? Did they have to submit accounts to the Department each year? Have they bought properties using that fund and, if so, who owns them?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Could Mr. Ó Foghlú give us a note on how much they received, the accountability process that was in place for each of them, whether they purchased properties and, if so, whether they are still in use and what will happen to them?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Will Mr. Ó Foghlú tell us about the other properties?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: Could the Department send us a note on that?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: The work of both the commission on school accommodation and the inquiry into Kilkenny City Vocational School has been concluded. The overall cost of that is noted. Is it an ongoing cost regarding Kilkenny City Vocational School?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: What was the total cost of it on conclusion?

Public Accounts Committee: 2012 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 26 - Education and Skills
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting
Chapter 12 - Contract Management in Education PPP Projects
Financial Accounts 2012
(15 May 2014)

John McGuinness: The total cost of such expenditure on commissions and inquiries up to 2012 was €1.16 million.

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