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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: I am going to go back to the novel procedures because the waffle around it was not acceptable. The witnesses are and telling us that they cannot publish a report because they are worried about naming people. Yet they cannot give us a straight answer as to whether the parents were notified, whether they gave consent and whether they knew it was novel procedures they were signing up to.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Yes. We know that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: We are well aware of how that works.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Ms Nugent does not know. That is fine. It was mentioned that a clinical ethics process is now in place. Why is it only in place now? It is not a corner shop that CHI is running. It is working with children in a hospital. Where was that process before this point?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: What had that committee done during that time? Why is there a massive need now for an enhanced one? What was the role of this committee in the first place?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Yes, we know that, but we know that did not happen here either.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Perfect. Did that committee flag this?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Why was this clinical committee that was already not flagging the novel procedures initially when this was happening? Why is there a need to put in a second committee?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Why not?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Can Ms Hardiman tell us why it has not been set up?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Turning to Ms Nugent, and I know she is new to the role, we have seen how the word "culture" is used here as a scapegoat, especially among medical professionals. We have seen it used by HIQA, and it has been stated that the issue is the need to change the culture. How, though, will the culture be changed when the core is rotten? I ask this because it starts at the core and feeds out. It...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Is Ms Nugent willing to do that for parents?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Is Ms Nugent willing to do those meetings for parents, where they can stand up and ask her these questions directly?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Perfect. I now have a question for Mr. Moore. He was quoted recently in The Sun on the subject of the funding as stating, "I had no hand, act, or part in the €19 million but my understanding is that every single penny was used in CHI". As the national clinical lead for spinal surgery, can he explain how he had no hand, act or part whatsoever in the allocation or oversight of the...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Okay, I will go to the HSE.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: Who had oversight of that funding and how it was spent? That question is for the CHI.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: It sounds like when it comes to the accountability that Senator Costello mentioned, nobody seems to be accountable for anything right now. It seems to be a case of passing the buck around and see who-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: That is fine but people need answers to the questions they have. While the “sorries” are welcome, there are parents and children who are worried and at their wits’ ends. They do not know what will happen. They are in the dark and we are being told here that the culture is going to change, it is going to be fixed and then it should be better. That is not good enough....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: There was nothing because she is still sitting here.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Health: Treatment of Children with Dysplasia and Scoliosis and Related Matters: Discussion (19 Jun 2025)

Nicole Ryan: I understand and appreciate that. However, if I was in a position where I did not do my job diligently, I would not be sitting in front of Ms Hardiman now.

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