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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Was that five or six, or 20 or 30?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I want to develop that point a little because it is a very relevant one. Between PIAB and the courts we are getting visibility to a certain extent on about 30% of claims. We do not appear to have any visibility on 70% of claims, where legal costs could be at 90% or at 9%, but we do not know. Mr. Fielding's comment, which I do not doubt is perfectly accurate and valid, is on Injuries Board...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: One could take the view that claims costs have not changed, but the insurance industry will come in and say it is settling so many claims because companies cannot rely on going to courts where one judge gives €15,000 and another gives €75,000 for the same injury. I do not want to put words in their mouths but I want to be sure of what Mr. Fielding said. It is Injuries Board...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Of course.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: It is a lack of data.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Since our private session yesterday morning, where I asked about it in reference to the IBEC contribution, every committee member who has spoken has asked whether there is an opportunity to broaden this set of sessions to business insurance and insurance generally. I am getting restaurateurs, publicans and hoteliers all saying that their insurance costs are increasing massively, which has...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: For my own clarification, Dr. Gillen is talking about somebody or some organisation trusted with all the data, which comes out in aggregate form which the industry is collecting and which shows it is spending a certain percentage on legal costs, on medical costs, on material damage repair claims, on injuries and so on in order that we see how the motor insurance industry is performing in its...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: That is what we have all been talking about from the very first moment yesterday morning. We all have buckets of stories and anecdotal evidence, which is all true in itself, but the data in totality may not reflect it or may absolutely reflect it. We just do not know. The only thing we know is that motor insurance premiums have gone up by 36%, 38% or 40% in the past 12 to 15 months. I am...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: And we are all paying for it now.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We take that point. The likelihood is that any new entrant will go in to get business for themselves, but that will, by and large, be at the expense of other business, particularly in something like motor insurance. One does not create extra motor insurance just because one enters the market. One can argue in an airline scenario that if one drops the price enough, people travel more, but...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The incentive is gone.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We have had a very productive and helpful discussion from all of the witnesses, whom I thank for their opening statements and the questions and answers session since. Motor insurance premiums went up by 35 to 40% in the last year. What does each organisation believe to be the number one reason - or two or three reasons if the witnesses need them - for this rise in the past year? Is it...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Without putting words in Ms Callan's mouth, she does not buy into the idea that super-normal profits are being generated here.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Not without the data to substantiate it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Do any of the witnesses have an opinion on the Competition and Consumer Protection Commission looking at the figures? Dr. Gillen's point was on the concept of a black box and all of the players' data becoming available anonymously and not for the benefit of competitors. At a previous session, the point was made that it could be argued the industry is operating as a form of a cartel, and on...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We are not saying it does. Members suggested that it should.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (8 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: On behalf of the committee, I thank the witnesses for their genuine, honest and open engagement with us in their opening statements, questions and answers and the documents they sent us in advance of the meeting. I particularly thank members, who were very participative in the process.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I thank the witnesses for their opening statements and their interaction to date, which has been very helpful. I did not disagree with any of our milder members on the various points they put across to the witnesses. All of the witnesses come from a relatively specialised or narrow part of the economy and they are equally important in their different ways. Everybody uses taxis, we are all...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I believe this is our fifth session of hearing from the various people we have invited to appear before the committee, and we have heard from many people. During the hearings we have heard about averages of 35%, 40% and 45% in the wider motor insurance industry. It is clear that Ms Murphy's industry is being targeted far more, by tenfold multiples. She is saying that somebody who was...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (13 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The 300% is in one case. Does Ms Murphy have any figures on the industry average?

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