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Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I am trying to be as understanding as possible.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: We are due to visit tomorrow. I look forward to that because there is nothing like seeing the situation on the ground. The only sight I have had of it up to now is from outside the perimeter fence, but I look forward to being in and around it with the other members of the committee. On the cost and the claims, of the six grounds set out, the sixth concerns contractors' claims for delays,...

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I am asking the question directly because some of these claims Mr. Gunning has outlined relate to delay and timelines. He has outlined, and I clearly understand, that as time passes further inflation kicks in, but there is also the question of loss of time and being off-site for unforeseen events like Covid. My point is that Mr. Gunning, as the chief officer, is telling me that he assumes...

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I am talking about what is happening on the site. There is a situation where the company or companies are in receipt of those subsidies for the period they are off the site, and they are claiming for the period they are off the site because they are carrying a loss. We have a situation where two months were lost, for which we have not got a clear explanation, and they then came back...

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I want to move on.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: At the weekend, there were media reports of Ministers being quoted as stating that this project is “flying blind”, that it is a case of “build it and send on the bill”, and so on. No one knows where it will end. Mr. Gunning understands why the public are alarmed when they read direct quotes like that, not from one Minister but apparently from different Ministers....

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I accept that. The last time Mr. Gunning was in front of the committee, towards the end of the meeting I asked him to confirm that the project would come in under €2 billion. On that day, he confirmed that he was not in a position to do so and it could well go over €2 billion. Is that still the case today?

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I will put it this way, he wanted to confirm-----

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: To be clear, Mr. Gunning was not able to confirm on that day that the project would come in under €2 billion and he is not in a position to confirm it today.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: The only answer we have at this point is the answer Mr. Gunning gave on 9 February.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: A number of Deputies want to come back in for a second time. I will allow them three minutes each.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I ask Deputies to stick to three minutes because I am trying to get them all in for a second round.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: Okay. I thank Mr. Devine.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I am sorry for rushing Mr. Devine.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I call Deputy Carroll MacNeill.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I ask the Deputy to be brief.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: We are going over the time allowed under the pandemic regulations. Unfortunately, it is my job to try to keep proceedings within the limits. I thank everybody for their patience. Before we go, I will ask Mr. Gunning when this committee will see the report on the cost and a definitive completion timeline? When should we have that? I understand the Department officials have had to leave...

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I know that.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: I am asking Mr. Gunning in his capacity as chief officer of the board.

Public Accounts Committee: National Paediatric Hospital Development Board: 2019 Financial Statement (Resumed) (13 Jul 2021)

Brian Stanley: Hold on a moment. On the final cost of the project, one professor in DCU has set out that the €1.4 million to €1.7 million does not include the cost of the fit-out. He has mentioned figures of between €800 million and €1 billion for the fit-out. Is that on the mark?

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