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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: Is Mr. Sloyan saying that there could be loopholes and he does not want people to know what they are?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: That is not a good position for a regulator to be in.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: That is what Mr. Sloyan said.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: With respect, it is the regulator's job to ensure that any loophole is closed down.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: It could be useful were Mr. Sloyan to present the committee with a paper on what the regulator is doing in this regard. The Chairman also asked about how the system worked outside and inside the country and the cap that was applied. In my view, that cap is too high. The issue of the online presence is concerning. We need more information. What is the Star Store programme?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: This concerns the promotion, advertisement and sale of the products. Who is Mr. Niall Andrews?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: For whom?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: When he tells us that there has been a significant investment of €3 million in the Star Store programme, that is essentially €3 million spent on pushing products.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: I can refer to him otherwise. What is his title? He is the sales manager.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: PLI's head of sales is quoted as saying that it will invest €3 million in Star Store. He stated: "The impulse element of the tickets is such a big draw. When they're positioned right, they're talking directly to the customer." He said that the objective of the Star Store programme was to drive sales through growth and profitability in stores by making the national lottery agent...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: From my baseline, desktop research, it strikes me that there is a lack of real oversight and regulation of how the company is pushing its products. The fact that it is engaging a company to push its products is a red line for me. I put it to Mr. Sloyan that it should be a red line for him also. I have been told that the odds of winning on a scratch card are one in four or one in five....

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: What is the average scratch card? Is it the €2 card?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: The odds are one in four. However, if one bought a €2 card and won €2, that would be considered a win. It would not really be one.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: In his opening statement Mr. Sloyan said he could only speak in general terms about some of his work because of commercially sensitive and confidential information. Will he explain what he means by "commercially sensitive" from the point of view of the regulator's work?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: Given that this is a company which has had a monopoly for 20 years, how can the information be commercially sensitive?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: For a regulator with oversight of-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: A regulator must, on the one hand, look at the public interest and then at what Mr. Sloyan describes as "commercially sensitive information".

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: What advice did the regulator receive on balancing the public interest and commercial sensitivity? Mr. Sloyan is coming to an Oireachtas committee. We are the legislators and also accountable to the people. Mr. Sloyan is, in essence, accountable to us. When he says he cannot discuss a lot of stuff because of commercial sensitivity, it could be seen as he does not really want to talk about...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Overview of Operations of the National Lottery: Discussion (7 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: I will conclude. I thank Mr. Sloyan for his comments. For the record of the committee, I note that I am very concerned about the product range and that there are not sufficient checks and balances to protect citizens against gambling. We need a report from the regulator on the range of cards available, their cost, the online presence and the limitations and protections in place. That is...

Commission of Investigation (Certain Matters Relative to Disability Service in the South East and Related Matters): Motion (Resumed) (8 Mar 2017)

David Cullinane: There is no doubt the Minister of State, Deputy Finian McGrath, is a thoroughly decent person and in my book, he has always strived to do the right thing. It is incumbent on him, the Government and all Ministers to make sure we get this right. We heard this morning from two former members of the Committee of Public Accounts who have examined many of these issues in great detail, namely,...

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