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Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: We have received correspondence in the past on certain issues. We may put all of the various documentation together and seek a response to it from Bord na gCon.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Okay, we will do that. The next item is the agenda for our meeting at 10 a.m. on Thursday, 14 March. The agenda for the meeting will be the 2011 Appropriation Accounts and annual report of the Comptroller and Auditor General: Vote 38 - social protection; chapter 21 - expenditure on welfare and employment schemes; chapter 22 - welfare overpayment debts; and chapter 23 - regularity of social...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Before we commence I remind members, witnesses and those in the Public Gallery to turn off their mobile phones because the interference from them affects the sound quality and transmission of the meeting. I advise witnesses that they are protected by absolute privilege in respect of the evidence they give to the committee. However, if they are directed by the committee to cease giving...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I welcome the witness from the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform and ask him to introduce himself.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I ask the Comptroller and Auditor General to introduce the accounts.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I thank Mr. McCarthy. I now invite Mr. Moran to make his opening statement.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: May we publish Mr. Moran's statement?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I call Deputy O'Donnell. Deputy Ross will resume when he returns.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I ask Mr. Moran to give a direct answer to that question and then we will move to Deputy Ross.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I remind Deputy Ross of the time.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: I will ask the Deputy to finish.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Before asking a number of questions relating to the Comptroller and Auditor General's opening remarks this morning I join other members in complimenting the Minister, Mr. Moran and his staff on the progress made in the past 12 months. We have picked up intelligence and information, although it is not easy from a legal or banking point of view to understand all of what is happening at a quick...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: What are we repaying in interest year on year? The year 2013 provided a sum of €8 billion. From 2008, what were we paying up to the figure for 2013, which is the highest point on the graph? We can see the growth pattern to that point. How long will it stay at that level and what part of this is moveable? Will the number be €7 billion or €8 billion and will it be...

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Which is €8 billion.

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Yes. In euro, what will it cost to service the debt?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: What will be the impact on that of the markets? That €8 billion from 2013 up to €10 billion in 2014 or 2015 is affected by the cost of funds and so on. What fluctuation will take place in that market to reduce the figure?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Is that 2015 onwards?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: Is that in significant sums?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: One could say, as a yardstick for the next number of years to 2015, the debt repayment figure will range between the 2013 figure of €8 billion and the suggested figure that Mr. O'Neill gave us of €10 billion. Is that not going to change?

Public Accounts Committee: 2011 Appropriation Accounts and Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General
Vote 6 - Office of the Minister for Finance
Chapter 1 - Financial Outturn for 2011
Chapter 2 - Government Debt
Chapter 3 - Banking and Insurance Measures
Chapter 5 - EU Financial Transactions
(7 Mar 2013)

John McGuinness: That is the level of repayment of debt that we must meet. It just helps things.

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