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Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: At this time of the evening, as I seem to be the last Deputy, or one of the last to speak, tiredness is getting to me. That is a fundamental question that should be answered and should certainly be answered before Mr. Waters appears before the committee again. Companies were formed. As I understand it gardaĆ­ of higher rank and lower rank were directors. Was permission given for that?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Mr. Waters should have. I am sorry, we should have this information. This came up. He is fully aware of this in respect of the directors. Did they have permission to do that? The Department of Justice and Equality should be in a position to tell us.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Did they have permission? Can gardaĆ­ form companies using public moneys?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: We are not talking about 1992.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: There are no records in the Department of Justice and Equality.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Has the Department done a timeline and looked at the interim audit from its point of view and what was brought to its attention? Has it looked at that and noticed a half-completed report in 2006? What was the Department of Justice and Equality's response to that in 2006?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: I was giving out earlier about people making statements and I am reluctant to do so but I have no confidence in what I have heard today and on the last occasion. I simply do not. There was a report in 2006, that seems to be incomplete. There was a report in 2008 that went to the Commissioner, who acted, and which went back to the person in charge of Templemore, who said that the money...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Was I telling a mistruth or misreading the situation when I read it out?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: I do not want judgments. It is not a court of law. What I want to know is what concerns Mr. Waters had about that and what he is doing about that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: I am only talking about the role of the Department of Justice and Equality now.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: The money was coming through the Department of Justice and Equality. It was public money.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Sorry, it was all public money that was going down to Templemore.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: Okay.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: I am talking about public funds, per capitaor however it was allocated,-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: -----down to Templemore that went into 50 accounts.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: There is no misunderstanding about this. It is public funds going in, and we have a Commissioner or somebody under the Commissioner saying that is right but they were not getting enough money from Government and they were entitled to invest this, open up accounts and do what we want with it. I read that out, did I not?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: What is the reaction of the Department of Justice and Equality to that?

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: We are not looking at legacy issues here. This is something that went on and on. As ordinary TDs we are here struggling, reading lots of documentation and trying to hold the system to account as best we can. The Department officials are the ones with the responsibility and the resources. Is it correct that the Department was made aware of this way back - Mr. Waters has given the timeline...

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: The Department undertook a trawl.

Public Accounts Committee: 2015 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriations Account (Resumed)
Vote 24 - Justice and Equality (Resumed)
Chapter 6 - Procurement and Management of Contracts for Direct Provision (Resumed)
(11 May 2017)

Catherine Connolly: What steps were taken?

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