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Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: How many people were housed through HAP schemes in each of those years?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: How many residencies will be accommodated by the outturn of €564 million?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: For the current year.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: It will be in the region of 74,000.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: I understand the RAS will remain fairly static. In 2020, €133 million was spent on RAS.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: The figure decreased last year.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: The figure I have is €122 million. Is that right?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: An increase is forecast for the coming year, however.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: Does Mr. Doyle expect that to be spent?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: How many tenancies were affected in 2020 and 2021, respectively? What is the expected number for 2022?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: Okay. Rent supplement is paid through another Department but there is obviously a relationship with Mr. Doyle's Department because people who are on rent supplement-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: The figures I have are that in 2020 the expenditure on rent supplement was €95 million, while last year it was €123 million. That seems to be a substantial increase. Does Mr. Doyle have a rationale for why that is the case?

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: In terms of emergency accommodation, the expenditure has been dropping. The figure I have is €271 million for 2020.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: I take it that figure does not include emergency accommodation for people seeking international asylum.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: It comes from a different Department. I refer to the estimated outturns of €585 million for HAP and €133 million for RAS. I will assume rent supplement will remain static in the context of the upward trajectory we have seen, giving a figure of €123 million. The amount for emergency accommodation is €194 million. If we also take into account the figures Mr....

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: Essentially, what we are talking about here is people who are availing of schemes that involve subsidies to private interests. In most instances, those people would be better served by, and much prefer to be housed in, a direct social housing scheme, as was traditionally the case.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: The Department's trajectory was mentioned earlier on. The ratio referenced for 2017 was 50:50 in terms of what would be spent on subsidisation versus capital and the trajectory was to move that to 75:25.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: Essentially, that is a recognition on the part of the Department that these schemes did not represent good value for money.

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: If we go back to the year of appropriation, when we are talking about €464 million for HAP; €133 million for RAS; €95 million for rent supplement and €271 million for emergency accommodation. Mr. Doyle was indicating there was a distinction between some of the SHCEP scheme funding in terms of private leasing arrangements and others, which I gather are approved...

Public Accounts Committee: 2020 Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 34 - Housing, Local Government and Heritage
(17 Feb 2022)

Matt Carthy: Yes. For private landlords.

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