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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I am not asking you about your position as chairman of the risk committee. I am asking you a specific question, Mr. Considine. As a public interest director, appointed under specific legislation by the then Minister for Finance, the late Deputy Brian Lenihan, have you on any occasion given a formal report to any Minister for Finance, to the Department of Finance or to the Central Bank?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: Mr. Richie Boucher, the chief executive officer of Bank of Ireland, appeared before this committee a couple of weeks ago. He said there was no difference between public interest directors and standard directors, except that public interest directors were not elected. Would you agree with that opinion?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: We know that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I will repeat the question. When Mr. Boucher appeared before this committee he said the only difference between public interest directors and appointed directors of Bank of Ireland was that the former were not elected. He said that both types of director had the same duty of care and under company law had the same responsibilities. Would you agree that you are just directors, like anybody...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I am asking both of you that question.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: You are drifting. I need you to be more specific. I will invite Mr. Considine to answer the question and then come back to you, Mr. Walsh. Mr. Considine, what distinguishes you from the other directors on the board of Bank of Ireland?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: Mr. Considine, you were appointed as a public interest director. You were not elected to the board but were appointed by the Minister for Finance in 2009 and have served on the board of the bank for four years. I am not interested in what other directors are doing. Bank of Ireland is partly owned by the State and those directors have a job to do. You also have a specific job to do and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: Can you be specific and tell me about, for example, one single decision or proposal that either yourself or Mr. Walsh have put before the board, as public interest directors?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I have a final question. A number of measures have been put in place, both by the current Administration and the previous one, concerning banks engaging with small and medium enterprises and distressed mortgages. In his role, I am sure that Mr. Walsh is familiar with the level of despair that currently exists both in the business and residential sectors. On any occasion at board level, has...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: Thank you very much, Mr. Considine. I call Deputy Fleming.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: The legislation actually stated that the Minister may make and publish guidelines in relation to this.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: No.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: With respect, I am just producing the legislation.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I shall furnish Deputy Fleming with as much time as he wants. At each interjection I make, his time will be returned to him. I am saying, however, that the legislation allowed for the Minister to provide terms of reference, which he did not.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I respect that view.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: Deputy Fleming must be brief because he is over time.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I must interrupt. The Deputy used the word "lied". He should use words such as "untruth", "disingenuous" or something similar. May I ask the Deputy to correct that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: I ask the Deputy to correct his remark as I do not wish to suspend the sitting.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: With respect, Mr. Walsh and Mr. Considine are mirroring the behaviour of their chief executive officer at a meeting of this committee a month ago in terms of his pleading the fifth and stating he was operating in the bank's interests. Mr. Walsh and Mr. Considine are not even responding to questions this morning. I ask Mr. Walsh to respond to Deputy Doherty's question.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Role and Contribution of Public Interest Directors in Financial Institutions: Discussion (20 Dec 2012)

Ciarán Lynch: There is a specific question before Mr. Walsh. By way of clarification, I was correcting Deputy Doherty's use of language, not the question, which is valid. The bank provided information to the Minister for Finance which was incorrect. As a former Minister who has answered parliamentary questions, Mr. Walsh will know the significance of putting an answer on the record. Deputy Doherty has...

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