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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Whoever is appropriate may take it.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: How did the Prison Service not foresee it would require nets? Nets have been a very common feature of the Irish Prison Service for many years. How did it not envisage it might require bomb detection equipment and why was it urgent?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Ms McCaffrey is not talking about something one walks through or which scans.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: I see. I accept that. I will make the point about nets. They are a small thing. What about handcuffs? How was it not envisaged handcuffs would be needed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: I am confused. Handcuffs are handcuffs are handcuffs. Are they special handcuffs?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Okay. I am still confused but I will not dwell on it. What is a proprietary purchase?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: That seems prudent. The only other matter in the non-compliance with national procurement rules is on the €5.2 million figure. Of the 18 procurement scenarios, some are still under review. My understanding is that this is a common feature in the Prison Service where matters are being reviewed. Could Ms McCaffrey give us some of the details of this amount?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: There has been a significant increase in the volume of instances of non-compliance. From 2012 to 2017, it increased almost fivefold from ten instances, worth just shy of €1 million, to 50 with a value of €8.8 million. The Prison Service constantly reviews how it operates procedurally as a quasi-Government department. Is there anything the service can do to improve how it...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: I thank Ms McCaffrey, but I will revert to the mention of matters that should not be disclosed in the public domain. While I accept that, who on the line committee is responsible for making that determination?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Who has oversight of that process other than the service's line committee? Does the Minister have oversight? Is there a feed-in process? Is what should and should not be disclosed discussed?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: I thank Ms McCaffrey. She touched upon the financial control issue in terms of procurement. There was a report on other operations of the service in, I believe, 2015. I am sorry, as I had the information in front of me a moment ago. The report was commissioned internally regarding the operation of various funds and programmes within the Irish Prison Service and a review was conducted. I...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Please, do.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: It was important to say. Anything that improves financial controls is to be welcomed. For the want of a better description, the Prison Service effectively operates a bank for members of the public who are incarcerated. Is the administration of that a process-heavy operation? The service must have an effective computer system. Could Ms McCaffrey provide some information on it, please?...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: How many people are responsible for the operation of this facility?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Are whole-time equivalent staff working on it? Is it a full-time job or just something that needs to be-----

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: That would be helpful. I recognise that it is an essential function that must be provided. I imagine it would be almost impossible to do it in any other manner. Despite the insignificance of the sum, the figure for the management of petty cash jumped out at me. It was minuscule at approximately €1,000 or something along those lines. Is it recognised that there are improvements...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: It is an insignificant sum, but at the same time cumulatively it is not great to see a small amount of cash not being accounted for appropriately. Whether it has been misplaced, lost, spent or not recorded properly is not really the point. I would like to ask about the tuck shop. How am I doing for time? Do I have five minutes left?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Grand. Perfect. This question is rather appropriate in the context of prisoners' injury and compensation claims. How does our figure of approximately 5% benchmark against other prison services, to the best of Ms McCaffrey's knowledge? In her opening statement, she gave us figures on absenteeism which appear to benchmark relatively well against other countries. While I welcome that, it...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Okay. The ratio of the cost of legal services to the level of compensation payments - it is roughly 2:1 - is a very common theme across a lot of Government Departments. Is there a manner in which that figure can be reduced? Is the Prison Service talking about the volume of individual claimants who are dealt with individually? I ask Ms McCaffrey to comment on that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 21 - Prisons
(17 Jan 2019)

Alan Farrell: Members of the public made 37 claims against the Prison Service in 2017. I presume there is a good chance that most of them have been resolved by now. What would the nature of those claims be?

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