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Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: I thank the Cathaoirleach and wish my colleagues a good evening. I thank them for the opportunity to attend the committee today to discuss budget 2024, which the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform, Deputy Donohoe, and I will present to the Oireachtas on Tuesday, 10 October. I will begin by outlining the economic and fiscal context for...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: I thank the Deputy for his question. Overall, across the year so far, corporation tax receipts are on profile. We anticipated when we published the stability programme update, SPU, in April that corporate tax receipts would grow by approximately 7% over 2022 levels. In the year to the end of August, we are pretty much on profile, with 7% growth, notwithstanding the reduction relative to...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: As the Deputy knows, we have invested a lot as a Government in the OECD process, which the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, was very much involved in negotiating and helped to shape. That was a very significant moment for Ireland because the 12.5% rate has been a bedrock of our industrial policy for a significant number of years, but we made the decision to be part of a global deal to provide...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: It is a net spending rule so it is open to the Government to raise additional taxation through policy decisions and that then creates additional room if we want to stay within the 6.1%, which is the summer economic statement policy decision. That enables us to do more on taxation or expenditure. That is the way in which the net spending rule works.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: No. If we are to make any decisions to raise additional debt relief notices, DRNs, with which the Deputy will be familiar, that increases the scope we have in the budget, either on taxation in terms of reductions or on the spending side, so it is a net spending rule. We are applying the 6.1% on the spending side because on the taxation side, if we were to do nothing it would automatically...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: We raise in the region of that figure from non-indexation of the system. That is the manner in which we apply the net spending rule.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: The Minister for Public Expenditure, National Development Plan Delivery and Reform and I are working to implement the summer economic statement parameters. We brought it to Government. We endorsed it and we got a mandate to proceed to develop a budget consistent with the summer economic statement. That is what we intend to do and that work is now well under way

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: The overall package is €6.4 billion. The Deputy is referring to one component of that. In overall terms, the package is €6.4 billion. The split is as we set out in the summer economic statement and the Government has not made any decision to change that figure. It is our intention to proceed on the basis of the summer economic statement.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: I want to reaffirm the point the Minister made. The Deputy quotes the article correctly but the Central Bank, as a body offering policy advice to Government, is not advising the Government to spend more money. If he is to be consistent and if he supports what the Central Bank advocates in that article, the Deputy presumably supports the overall position on fiscal policy the bank has taken...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: There is no getting away from the fact the inflation we have experienced in the past year and a half or so has really hurt people. We have not seen inflation at these levels for about 40 years. It has had a significant impact. I am sure the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, will point out in a moment the analysis his Department has done on the combined impact on lower income households of all the...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: With your indulgence, Chair, I will just add a word in response to the earlier exchange and the Minister, Deputy Donohoe, will come in on the funding issues for mental health. The Deputy is correct, overall, on the issue of corporate profitability. This is something the IMF has examined and published. That is why, in the case of energy for example, the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, has...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: I thank the Deputy. To take the two areas of additional revenue and to start with the one he raised specifically, namely, the cap on market revenues, as he knows, the legislation giving effect to that is currently before the Oireachtas. As the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, alluded to in his reply to Deputy Nash, the proceeds from that will be collected by the Commission for Regulation of...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: To reduce tariffs, yes.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: On your bill.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: That is my understanding.

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: Our focus is on budget 2024. That will be the main fiscal event of the year and will lay out our plans for all of next year. We have indicated that we will again bring forward a package of temporary one-off measures. I note the Deputy's comments in relation to those one-off measures. I think there has been an attempt to almost devalue the value of those one-off measures. They were real...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: Many people were able to use those payments over a period of time. Of course it is different in nature to a weekly payment. We acknowledge that but we know that they were welcomed by many of those who received them. We have no plans to do anything in the spring of 2024. We are preparing the budget now for next year. There will be some additional measures that we will lay out on budget...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: First of all, I strongly defend the parameters of the budget. We have had a difficult balance to strike and I think we have stuck the right balance. People will form their own views of that in just under two weeks' time when they see the budget. We want to provide help to people where we think it is warranted. We need to spend enough money to do that. At the same time we do not want to...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: We have a programme for Government commitment on income tax that provides for the indexation of bands and credits. There are different options and combinations that are possible as part of that. As the overall envelope is just over €1.1 billion on the tax side, I will bring forward a fair and balanced tax package which will provide benefits for all income earners. Of course, I will...

Committee on Budgetary Oversight: Pre-Budget Engagement (Resumed): Ministers for Finance and Public Expenditure, NDP Delivery and Reform (27 Sep 2023)

Michael McGrath: I am very conscious of the work of the commission and the report is on my desk. Of course I am dipping in and out of it and looking at the various recommendations. I will not give any indication on any specific measure but if the Deputy looks at the broad point it makes, it makes the point that into the future there will be a need for additional taxation to fund the running of the State....

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