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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: We are out of time. I know Dr. Byrne wanted to come in on that. I have to move on to the next speaker but I flag to the other members that Dr. Byrne wanted to comment on that. I call Deputy Cian O'Callaghan.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: I am glad I did not cut off Mr. Davitt that time as I have cut him off every other time. I was feeling bad.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: I call Senator Moynihan.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Mr. Davitt is very quick.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: To be fair, Deputy Higgins is next.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Of course. It is up to members to direct their questions.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: If members direct their questions, I am bound by that. It is the members' time to use as they see fit. The opening statements were the unrestricted time allocated to the witnesses. It is the members' fault, not mine. I call Deputy Higgins.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: There is time available for Deputy Higgins to put a question to Ms O'Reilly.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: There is the third round as well.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: As I said earlier, it is at the members' discretion.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Thank you. I will take my slot now. My colleagues can ensure I do not abuse the clock. We could talk about the entire housing market and that is what we do here on a weekly basis, and sometimes it is hard to pin it down to one area. I agree with the assessment we have had on the under-supply of public housing for a decade. The strong commitment to public housing on public land will help...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Is not the real factor about exiting the asset from the business at the end if they want to sell it, that is, the taxation responsibilities for selling a property from a company?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: If they were to sell the company as a limited company, are there much more onerous capital gains responsibilities than if selling as an individual?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: With regard to ongoing taxation, we have heard that companies can earn money and pay a lower corporation tax than an individual pays in income tax. Mr. Davitt is saying that is not a factor.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: If there are more attractive tax arrangements within a company and that would result in them paying less tax, why would they not do that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: They pay the tax when it comes out.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Is that not true also for institutional investors in that they pay the tax when they take the money out of the company?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: If it was within a company, they could use it as a pension asset.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: That is my point. It seems a bit of a technical matter, but if we make it more attractive for taxation purposes, that does not necessarily impact the overall decision as to how that person manages the property and whether to sell it or not to sell it, or when to sell it. I turn to a second issue of tenancies offered by the local authorities. There is the possibility of ten-year or...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Housing, Planning and Local Government: Private Rental Sector: Discussion (20 Sep 2022)

Paul McAuliffe: Any business on a long-term contract with a customer would make the same commercial decision. Would that be fair?

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