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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Ms Dowling said that the raw data or somebody else's number-crunched data were inaccurate. If we were to put in place laws and if this committee was to recommend-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I am trying to interrogate the content of that. If we got raw data through some anonymised source or black box type scenario, it is would be workable and useable.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Ms Dowling said that she got data from insurance companies and even that data was unreliable.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Yes. I am sure the committee would benefit from that person's existence if we get that far and I hope we do.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We had representatives from that profession before the committee yesterday and we heard from them as well. If we get and process all that data, hopefully we will get improved transparency on the insurance industry with respect to what it is saying versus, for example, the letters Aviva is sending out detailing the cost of whiplash claims. My argument regarding whiplash awards, albeit that...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: That has not caused an increase in premiums. Also, road safety statistics have not really changed.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The road network has not really changed, nor has the number of vehicles on the road, albeit there is a larger number.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: There are not 70% more vehicles on the road and I accept there are more premiums.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The early days of the national car test would have flushed out the old cars.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: We get all the data and we still wonder why insurance premiums have gone up by 70% over the past two to three years. Some 10% of claims are resolved in the courts, 20% are resolved with the Injuries Board but we have no visibility on 70% of claims. On those 70% of claims, is it credible that all of the increase the industry states is required, separate from the element of Solvency II and...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I am the last member to speak but that is the way it worked out.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Okay.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I am conscious of the time and there are many other questions I could ask.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Ms Dowling might be asked to do so. In terms of legal cases, if say the Injuries Board makes an award €16,000 and the courts make an award of €15,999, the plaintiff does not get their costs covered.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: If the courts make an award of €16,001, then-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Is it valid to say that if a person refuses an award of, say, €16,000 from the Injuries Board and subsequently is given an award of €15,999, that they will have the burden of covering their costs and the other side's costs, but if they have been given an award of €16,001, they would not have the burden of those costs?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I accept that but is that not part of the problem?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: I have a brief question for the brokers. Reference was made to Quinn Insurance, which is gone now. It charged a low premium and settled claims quickly. It was fine if one did not have a claim and but if one had a claim, it might have been a bit difficult. I am not sure that Ms O'Callaghan's point about windscreen cover is particularly valid. I have been driving more than 20 years and I...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: The figure we were given last week is 92%. It appears that 90% to 92% of policyholders are paying for 8% of claims. That is the purpose of insurance, so fair enough. My question to Ms Dowling and the brokers, although the brokers may not be able to answer it, is do they believe current behaviour in the insurance market is like a cartel? I am sure all of the witnesses have had dealings...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

Gerry Horkan: Fair enough.

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