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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: On the Monday or Tuesday, yes. Subsequently it transpired there was no issue with passing on the email.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: We have heard a lot of commentary about submissions and emails, and the difference between a submission to a Minister and an email. Have there been many submissions on whistleblowers in general to Ministers over the past couple of years?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: In Mr. Justice Charleton's commentary, and in his call last February for co-operation with the tribunal, he called on all parties who had information that was relevant to pass it on. Notwithstanding the specific request made of the Department, and I note it has made some voluntary disclosures outside of this, I am flabbergasted, to be quite honest, that Ms McPhillips would contend that an...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: I will stop Ms McPhillips there. I am fully aware of the orders from the tribunal and-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: I am fully aware of the orders. I am also fully aware that to be fair the Department did make some voluntary disclosures. Do the officials now think it would have been more appropriate to provide all documents, regardless of whether the Department deemed them to be relevant, and let the tribunal decide on their relevance?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: The Taoiseach ordered the Department to conduct a trawl and documents were put together over a five-day period. Has the Department handed over the documents to the tribunal?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: I shall return to my original point and paraphrase Justice Charleton's call for co-operation. In February he called on all parties who had any information that might be relevant to provide same. It now transpires that the Department has documents that were relevant and that it decided what it should hand over to the tribunal. It has emerged that not alone were there a couple of emails but...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Does the Secretary General agree that the Taoiseach's contention that the Department is dysfunctional has been proved?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: That is fine.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Put it like this, I must say that in my six and a half years as a member of the Oireachtas Committee on Justice and Equality, this is probably the most extraordinary meeting I have ever attended. I have never come across a situation where senior public servants have effectively stonewalled. The bottom line is that the acting Secretary General cannot accept the fact that regardless of...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Functioning of the Department of Justice and Equality: Department of Justice and Equality (6 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Perhaps the Secretary General might like to reflect on her constant assertion that the Department fully complied with the tribunal, particularly in view of the fact that significant additional information had to be provided to it. She might like to correct the record of the committee in that regard in order to protect the integrity of her Department.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Does Mr. Nugent not think he should know?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Mr. Nugent did a report and he does not know if it went to the Department of Justice and Equality.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: I, too, would like to be associated with the comments of wishing the member of An Garda Síochána who was shot this morning all the best. I listened carefully to the submissions and questioning this morning. Has the Garda identified areas where inflated figures for mandatory breath-testing were significant, as well as the individuals involved? It is not realistic to discipline...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: My concern is that if there are individuals capable of faking breath tests, checkpoints and results, who is to say they are not capable of going into court and faking evidence? Is there a possibility that there are people in prison today as a result of fake evidence in court?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Mr. O'Sullivan is missing the point.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: No, he cannot because he is missing the point and he is not addressing the question.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: It would be a great way to get rid of me.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: I will pair with Senator Lorraine Clifford-Lee.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Justice, Defence and Equality: Policing Issues: An Garda Síochána (7 Dec 2017)

Martin Conway: Yes, I would. The point I am making is that if an individual is capable of knowingly giving inaccurate information about checkpoints or faking breath tests, is it beyond the realms of possibility that the same lack of clarity and so forth could be associated with evidence in court?

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