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Health (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: I am trying to explain that it is part of the mixed messaging-----

Health (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: -----that this legislation and these amendments will lead to.

Health (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: Nobody else was interrupted when speaking.

Health (Amendment) Bill 2021: Committee Stage (Resumed) and Remaining Stages (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: I am talking about the mixed messaging that is going on. In dealing with this legislation I am asking that lessons be learned from that mixed messaging and that some corrections be made because the people are extremely angry with what is going on. They want to see a plan for the reopening of society and the economy. They want to know what their part in it is. They want to know what...

Written Answers — Department of Employment Affairs and Social Protection: Covid-19 Pandemic Unemployment Payment (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: 181. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection if the pandemic unemployment payment, PUP, will continue to be paid to a person (details supplied). [10734/21]

Written Answers — Department of Employment Affairs and Social Protection: Carer's Allowance (25 Feb 2021)

John McGuinness: 182. To ask the Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection if a carer’s allowance will be approved for a person (details supplied); and if the application will be expedited. [10736/21]

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: I ask members and all those present to turn off their mobile phones. I also ask members to identify themselves as they contribute to the meeting. If members remove their masks during their contributions, it helps with the recording of the meeting. I welcome the Minister and his officials. Members are reminded of the long-standing parliamentary practice to the effect that they should not...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: It is clear from the Minister of State's answer to Deputy Tóibín's questions and the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform's answers to previous questions that nothing has changed since the new Government took office. When Deputy Farrell asked the Minister of State about ventilators, surely he should have admitted that there is a policy issue and that there has been a failure...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: I asked the Minister of State.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: Would the Minister of State not have it investigated to determine whether it is a policy failure?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: I am not asking the Minister of State to do that. I am asking him to look at the overall policy. The Minister of State said he was the policymaker.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: In terms of making a policy, is there something wrong with this policy that has allowed this to happen without an intervention from the OGP? Does the Minister of State intend to change the policy? Is it for him to find out what went wrong with the existing policy and learn something from this? Have any of his officials made an effort to find out what happened and learn from the mistake?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: No, it is a matter for us here at this committee and I will not allow the Minister of State to dismiss it. This committee looks into reform as well and it is a matter for the committee to ensure the policymaker in this regard learns from this process and gathers the information to understand what happened to determine whether the Department will change the policy. There is no point in...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: I ask the Minister of State to give the committee an undertaking that his officials will engage with the HSE to see what happened, learn from this and influence further changes in policy. That is essentially the work of this committee.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: Who is on the reform board? How is its membership made up?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: Are any outsiders on that committee?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: The one is representative of what?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: There is one business person. How many insiders does it have?

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: Nine insiders and one outsider.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Estimates for Public Services 2021
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform (Revised)
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances (Revised)
Vote 14 - State Laboratory (Revised)
Vote 15 - Secret Service (Revised)
Vote 17 - Public Appointments Service (Revised)
Vote 18 - National Shared Services Office (Revised)
Vote 19 - Office of the Ombudsman (Revised)
Vote 39 - Office of Government Procurement (Revised)
Vote 43 - Office of the Chief Government Information Officer (Revised)
(2 Mar 2021)

John McGuinness: With a further outsider being appointed, it will have two. The Department certainly would not be interested in having it the other way round, with nine outsiders and two insiders. The time has come for radical reform in this area. We have seen this particular purchase go south on the taxpayer. We see that this particular board is completely controlled by what I would call insiders. We...

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