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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: The bank will receive €890 million plus 5%.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: That means one would have to deduct €45 million from that figure..

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: The loss to the bank is, therefore, greater than what we had seen.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: I understand that. However, the perception would be that the figure was greater than €890 million because there was to be a 5% shareholding on top of that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: The witnesses spoke of operating within the rules, doing so in good faith and so on. Did Permanent TSB apply the Central Bank of Ireland's code of practice on mortgage transfers?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Did Permanent TSB apply the Central Bank of Ireland's code of practice on mortgage transfers to this transfer? The bank was transferring more than 6,000 mortgages.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Did Permanent TSB, as a State-owned bank, apply the Central Bank of Ireland's code of practice on the transfer of mortgages?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Does the bank intend to apply the code of practice on the transfer of mortgages to the transfer.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: That is excellent. Mr. Crowley's answer is good news to everybody here. I will read the first line of the Central Bank code of practice on the transfer of mortgages. It states: "A loan secured by the mortgage of residential property may not be transferred without the written consent of the borrower." Will the bank apply that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Mr. Crowley replied "Of course" when I asked if the bank was going to apply the code of conduct on the transfer of mortgages. The code, which has been in place since 1990, is clear. It is voluntary and it is up to the bank whether to apply it. Mr. Crowley has told this committee that he will apply it. The former Minister for Finance believes that every bank should apply it and,...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: No, that is not what the code of practice says. I will go through it if Mr. Crowley wishes. It states:When seeking a consent and where there is to be or where there may be an arrangement under which the original lender will service the mortgage as an agent of any transferee, the lender will confirm that the transferee’s policy on the handling of arrears and in the setting of mortgage...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Mr. Masding is the top guy. This is the code of practice on the transfer of mortgages. I will read Mr. Masding the first line again: "A loan secured by the mortgage of residential property may not be transferred without the written consent of the borrower." Permanent TSB is a State-owned institution. I acknowledge the code is voluntary and I will table legislation in the coming days to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: I apologise for interrupting but the code does not say anywhere that it is voluntary. It does not say it is statutory - that is all. I take it Mr. Masding was not familiar with the code.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Is it not the case that Permanent TSB applies the Central Bank's code of conduct on mortgage arrears, which is voluntary?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: It does so although in the original contract there is no real requirement for the bank to engage with those types of measures. The bank has legal rights to do certain things and while the code of conduct limits these in a certain way, the bank complies with it. Is that correct?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: That is fine. The point I am making is that Permanent TSB is a State-owned bank. The public owns this bank.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: Yes. The State is the majority - 75% - owner of this bank.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: I have one more point to make after this. Permanent TSB is completely disregarding the code of practice on the transfer of mortgages because that code does not suit it. This is something that was agreed by the Central Bank. It is not coming from afar. Permanent TSB is deciding that something which is in place does not suit it. It knows that if it asked for the consent of its customers,...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: I suggest that the bank should talk to its customers for a start. I will not go into the mess that the bank made of its split mortgages. Those mortgages are defined as non-performing. In other banks that got it right, they are not defined as non-performing.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Sale of Permanent TSB Mortgage Loans: Discussion (6 Dec 2018)

Pearse Doherty: I have a question for Mr. Ryan.

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