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Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: I have a few more questions. Last week, we dealt with legal fees. One issue that emerged from the conversation was that the legal services are outsourced. There was a suggestion that in order to capture all of what was spent on legal fees, there should be some co-ordination with the Attorney General, the Department of Public Expenditure and Reform and so on. Is that suggestion being considered?

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: That answers the question. A similar issue arises in regard to third level institutions, including universities and institutes of technology, some of which have a contract through the HEA for auditing.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: To my mind, it is not satisfactory because it seems that having the one audit across all third level institutions is not working for other reasons. These reasons are better spelled out in the various complaints we have received from various bodies, ranging from the VECs to the institutes of technology and universities. That is certainly a matter Mr. Watt should examine because sometimes...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: Mr. Watt will not appear before us again. This committee, like the Dáil, is running to the end of its term, but this issue concerning institutes of technology, universities and so on will not go away. It needs to be reviewed and I am anxious to bring it to the attention of the Department today. The other matter concerned having one financial system for the HSE. I acknowledge it is...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: In his report Mr. Watt mentioned the Ombudsman, freedom of information and all of the various changes in that regard. My point concerns the work of committees of these Houses. There was a single taxpayer in whose case the Ombudsman recommended full payment on a particular issue. A half payment was made by the Revenue Commissioners. Ever since committees of the Houses, mainly those...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: That is an example of someone deliberately ignoring the hearings of a committee which were signed off on by a number of Chairmen. The matter concerns every party to the case. The payment should be reviewed and someone should ask about it. I do not know why the money is not being paid, particularly given the independence of the Ombudsman and the various reviews undertaken in the Houses and...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: That is the nature of the beast; it is democracy and it happens in the Houses.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: Yes, it can. It happens in the Dáil and the Seanad, as well as in other committees, and I cannot see it changing any time soon. In fact, I have seen a marked change in the opposite direction. The conversation that was had with the Deputy earlier is one that we could have about politicians, believe it or not. The point is we cannot change that. It is the way it is, and those who come...

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: When Secretaries General come in here, it is far better that they have that type of conversation rather than trying to hide behind some fact or other.

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: Otherwise, it will not change. That brings us to the point about local government. Reports, including value-for money reports, concerning local government are produced but they never get debated in the real public sense of what happens in this committee. The public sees that and if we ask people whether they want that type of secrecy or an open public debate, they want to see the latter....

Public Accounts Committee: 2014 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 11 - Office of the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform
Vote 12 - Superannuation and Retired Allowances
Vote 18 - Shared Services
Vote 41 - Office of Government Procurement
Chapter 4 - Vote Accounting and Budget Management
Chapter 5 - Management of Government Grants
Chapter 6 - Payroll Accrual for National Accounts
Chapter 7 - National Lottery Fund
(19 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: Is it agreed to dispose of Votes, 11, 12, 18 and 41 and Chapters 4 to 7, inclusive? Agreed. I thank Mr. Watt and his officials for attending the meeting. I have enjoyed our exchanges in the past few years. It has been good and healthy for our democracy.

Written Answers — Department of Social Protection: Community Employment Schemes Operation (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 164. To ask the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection her plans to relax the eligibility criteria for entry to a community employment scheme, with particular reference to persons under 25 years of age; if persons signing for credits will have their time considered in the context of qualifying for community employment; if persons under 35 years of age will qualify for three years on...

Written Answers — Department of Social Protection: Social Welfare Benefits (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 183. To ask the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection the reason a social protection benefit to a person (details supplied) in County Carlow was recently cut. [40619/15]

Written Answers — Department of Social Protection: Public Sector Staff Career Breaks (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 189. To ask the Tánaiste and Minister for Social Protection if she will review and expedite a request by a person (details supplied) in County Kilkenny, which was made in August 2015. [40689/15]

Written Answers — Department of Finance: Fuel Quality (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 214. To ask the Minister for Finance his plans to introduce certification or a qualification for public display in each petrol station that has been vetted by Customs and Excise for fuel quality, and has met the legal requirements, in order to inform the public; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [40538/15]

Written Answers — Department of Public Expenditure and Reform: Office of Public Works Properties (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 234. To ask the Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform if he will provide an explanation as to what is happening relative to the visit of the Office of Public Works to Durrow Abbey and the threat to break locks to gain entry; if the issue relative to the lease and grant awarded but unpaid that has been ongoing for five years has not been resolved; the efforts made to resolve matters; the...

Written Answers — Department of Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation: Fuel Quality (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 250. To ask the Minister for Jobs, Enterprise and Innovation to outline his plans to introduce certification or a qualification for public display in each petrol station that has been vetted by Customs and Excise for fuel quality, and has met the legal requirements, in order to inform the public; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [40539/15]

Written Answers — Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine: Agriculture Scheme Payments (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 287. To ask the Minister for Agriculture, Food and the Marine when a farm payment will be issued to a person (details supplied) in County Kilkenny; and if he will expedite the matter. [40468/15]

Written Answers — Department of Defence: Defence Forces Remuneration (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 310. To ask the Minister for Defence if he will review the issue which has arisen relative to the payment of the new recruits who reported for duty to the Curragh Camp (details supplied), who are now being informed they must repay €54 gross, as his Department states their commencement date was 24 September 2013; if the correspondence issued will be reviewed; if the payment to the...

Written Answers — Department of Health: Hospital Admissions (17 Nov 2015)

John McGuinness: 454. To ask the Minister for Health if a bed will be provided at the National Rehabilitation Hospital, as a matter of urgency, for a person (details supplied) in County Waterford who has been referred there by a consultant at Waterford Regional Hospital; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [40537/15]

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