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Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: Here are three examples of cyberfraud that we have spotted this year. That is an issue the Committee of Public Accounts certainly needs to come back to, because this is fraud targeting public expenditure, and represents a loss to the taxpayer. Cyberfraud and the associated public losses are another item for the work programme. I refer to the circumstances that gave rise to this incident....

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: A loss to the college.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: As such, it was a straight loss to a third level institution.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: Here we go again.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: That is the difference.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: We have been pleading with the universities to consolidate the foundations they control, and when they take control if something goes wrong, they carry the can. This sequence of events is unfortunate.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: It probably brought somebody in to do the investigation.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: We will come back to this in our work programme. We need ask every Accounting Officer standard questions about cyberfraud in their organisation, specifically what measures they have in place and whether there have been any incidents of cyberfraud. Maybe there are incidents we do not hear about.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: There is a Garda investigation.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: There is a police investigation under way in Ireland, the UK and Germany. We will ask for a breakdown of the loss in the meantime. We will also put the issue on our agenda for the autumn. No. 1480 is an anonymous item of correspondence regarding land in Ballsbridge which the correspondent states is owned by a particular developer in the National Asset Management Agency, NAMA. I have...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: I do not know which was the chicken and which was the egg. At this stage, I propose that we write to NAMA to seek a response to the issues raised. However, we will not get into any matter that has the potential to be defamatory or anything of that nature. We will write to NAMA but we do not want to send this letter to NAMA in case it is defamatory. As this is the last meeting, I do not...

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: To be fair, there might not have been a link with the article in the newspaper.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: There may be; I do not know.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: We will not circulate this letter to members, which they can see on the screen, but we will write to NAMA in the general context.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: A few members got it.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: I got it yesterday and another member told me they got it yesterday also, and the clerk to the committee got it.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: No. Say no more. The Deputy cannot draw a conclusion-----

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: I know. I think we are clear about what we are doing with this.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: Yes. That will be our first meeting. That is why I want this letter to go to NAMA. I am proposing that our first meeting in September will be with NAMA representatives. They have not been here since December 2016. It will be more than 20 months since they were before the committee.

Public Accounts Committee: Business of Committee (12 Jul 2018)

Seán Fleming: They are long overdue a visit. One of the reasons I want to clear this, even though it came in to us at the last minute, is that we can send it to NAMA. We will then be able to deal with the general issues when NAMA comes in before us. I think we are agreed on that.

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