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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Mr. Kenny has read them.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Mr. Kenny will be aware of the fact that cartel-type behaviour has been cited, mentioned and discussed.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Mr. Kenny will be aware of all of the issues that were put before the committee relative to access to the three databases that are next to nigh impossible to get at by any outside company.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I am extremely disappointed that the commission's investigation will be limited to the commentary in the newspaper about the 40% increase suggested by the insurance companies because if one is looking at pricing, surely one must look at why they are saying that. They are saying that as a result of the information they have which the commission does not have. However, the commission does not...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: So Mr. Kenny thinks the commission will get that information.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Therefore, to be clear about this, because it is a question that Deputy Sherlock was pursuing as well, the commission will get access to this much-protected set of databases.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Surely the commission's investigation will test those figures. In testing the figures, they must drill down, presumably for the commission, to prove their point and to offer the commission the documentation necessary to prove their case.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Is that what the commission will do? Will it ask them for that? That is what I want to know.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I return to the question I asked Mr. Kenny about becoming an associate member of Insurance Ireland and being able to access the databases, not knowing whether or not it is the full data one is accessing and then to be able to use that data to inform an outside company as to the market. Is that withholding information which, if given, would be in the public interest because it might create...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Okay. Senator Rose Conway-Walsh is next.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I remind the Senator of her time.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I remind the Senator about the time.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: I am conscious we have to start the next session at 3.45 p.m. so we will finish at 3.30 p.m., if that is agreed. Are there other questions members want to ask?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: Please continue.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: The Society of Actuaries in Ireland told the committee yesterday that it had approached numerous insurers to request data that would enable it to carry out data analysis. The insurers said they were willing to provide the information yet legal advice they received suggested there could be competitive issues around that.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: The fact of the matter is that the data that would inform those who might come into the market is not being made available. It is being withheld. One can only get the data if one pays a particular fee to be an associate member or member of Insurance Ireland. Surely that is the formation of a club, or dare I say it, cartel-like activity which holds the information at the centre and holds...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: No, it is not. That is the point.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: If one makes a distinction between proprietary and pay to access and so on, I will make a distinction along the lines of the questions asked by Deputy Sherlock. In the public interest, it would appear that if this information was made available to the industry, we might have greater competition in the market. Therefore, it is a case of the country coming first. The information is necessary...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: We thank the witnesses for their contribution.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Rising Cost of Motor Insurance: Discussion (Resumed) (15 Sep 2016)

John McGuinness: We are now joined by Mr. Kevin Thompson and Mr. Michael Horan of Insurance Ireland. I draw their attention to the fact that by virtue of section 17(2)(l) of the Defamation Act 2009, witnesses are protected by absolute privilege in respect of their evidence to the committee. If they are directed by the committee to cease giving evidence on a particular matter and they continue to so do, they...

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