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Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: That is not the intention. Given the scale of what is necessary from a data management perspective, cyber security perspective or integration perspective, we are looking at data providers. It would not be appropriate for the Department of Health or HSE, which are not IT companies but health service and policy delivery vehicles. That is not their function. I ask Mr. Tierney to elaborate on it.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I will ask Mr. Tierney to begin and I might come in after that.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: It would. That is what we are ultimately getting to, but this has to be a transition. There is no other practical way of doing it. I very much hope we will be having this conversation in a number of years from now and that we are talking about a single system as other countries in Europe have. While not all have managed to do it, those that have managed to do it have begun this journey a...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I will ask Mr. Tierney to take that. However, we need to be aware we are in a live procurement process.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: It would require very significant capital expenditure. We are in a live procurement process. We do, of course, have a budget at present of about €190 million which is keeping things going at the moment, maintaining our cyber security, and Mr. Tierney can provide more detail on that. We are in a live procurement process and we are talking about very significant capital investment.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: It is for the whole thing, including the planning of it. To get to the ultimate electronic health record, the unified system, we are talking about very significant capital expenditure.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: Nevertheless we are in a procurement process now. We are making a business case at present and we are also in NDP discussions. This is a public session, of course. I am very aware that vendors might have an interest in it. We need to manage our conversation on finances carefully in the interest of the State.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I would like Mr. Tierney to come in on the Deputy's earlier questions but I would also like Mr. O'Connor to give his perspective on the co-operation of the voluntary hospitals with, for example, the productivity dashboard. The purpose of Bill is to make sure there is no ambiguity regarding the sharing of information about the patient. That applies to all things. It is necessary that the...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I might ask Mr. O'Connor to speak about the productivity dashboard, which might be helpful.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: Does the Deputy mean resistance or reluctance on the part of individuals or hospitals?

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: We are very respectful of the personal rights of individuals and how their data is held and managed. There is a need to hold data electronically for the purposes of providing care, but there are certain guardrails put around who may access that data and on what basis. At the next level when we are looking at how we share and consider data on a more collective level, for health research for...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I might ask Mr. Tierney and Mr. O'Connor to come in on that.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I might ask Mr. O'Connor to answer the earlier question.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: To be clear, the guardrails are set out in section 12 of the Bill. It is important to say we are very respectful and concerned about individuals and their privacy. There are a couple of elements to that. One is that we need them to be in the electronic health system so they can get the quickest possible and the best, most integrated care. If you turn up to a hospital with a major trauma...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: Yes. Over time, all those records will be integrated into the system. It will take some time, and I will ask Mr. Tierney to speak to the specific timeline we hope to achieve and envisage achieving. Of course, it is subject to all the elements going well and having the funding to do this in the reasonable way we hope. The goal is that all records will ultimately be in this electronic...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I will just add that the app is really important. While the Internet signal is historically terrible in committee rooms in the basement in LH 2000, it is an app you can download. You need a MyGovID to sign in. Obviously, I expect everybody in the room has downloaded it and is part of the group of 80,000 people who have committed to registering their personal health information. The...

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: That would be the objective-----

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: That would be the objective because in the current instance that person would have to treated in any event. The objective would be that they would be able to access their records as quickly as possible with whatever identifier was available. The Deputy is right to identify the savings and I will ask Mr. Tierney to speak more to that. I visited the National Rehabilitation Hospital recently....

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I move amendment No.2: In page 6, to delete line 29 and substitute the following: “(e) data in relation to care (within the meaning of Regulation (EU) 2025/327 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 11 February 2025 on the European Health Data Space and amending Directive 2011/24/EU and Regulation (EU) 2024/2847);”.

Select Committee on Health: Health Information Bill 2024: Committee Stage (16 Jul 2025)

Jennifer Carroll MacNeill: I move amendment No. 3: In page 7, between lines 35 and 36, to insert the following: “ “personal public service number” has the same meaning as it has in section 262 of the Social Welfare Consolidation Act 2005;”.

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