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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: Mr. Cody can send a note with this information to the committee.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: The witnesses have said organised crime elements are involved in this. Out of all the activities that make money through organised crime, a culprit's chances of going to prison are probably the lowest for this one. As has been said, serious criminals are involved in this. They would laugh out loud at suspended sentences like that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: A guy caught with a bit of green diesel in the tank of his tractor or car gets a bigger fine than that. Those guys are charged €5,000 or €2,500. That is wrong too. I am not condoning it. I am just saying that the proportional difference between the fines and the gains here is extraordinary. Revenue probably cannot change that, but I find the figures extraordinary.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: They are not the real problem.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: However, Revenue does catch the guys that come in white vans loaded to the gills from Lithuania and other countries.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: Somebody is not taking it very seriously. I am not saying that about Revenue. Maybe it is only money.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: There is minimal deterrent for being involved in this trade, though Revenue may get a couple of big people in some cases. When drugs or tobacco are seized in customs operations at Portlaoise mail centre, how do the Revenue Commissioners dispose of them? Are they incinerated?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: There is a vote so if members want to leave for it, that is okay. I will finish this out.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: How is that done?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: Somebody in Ireland is licensed to do that.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: Do the cigarettes go there as well?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: It makes good electricity somewhere. Have the cigarettes that were taken off the ship at the port been incinerated?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: They are being held in evidence.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: It has been well reported that the nicotine and tar content of the illicit cigarettes that come in is much higher and they are a greater health hazard for the 13% who use them. Does the Revenue pass them on to the HSE? The HSE could undertake some promotion on this issue because a high number of people from eastern Europe are very heavy smokers and we will be paying for the hospital bills...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: The witnesses gave us a document with an analysis of the restrictions on high-income individuals for 2016. I understand that if people have an income of over €400,000 there is a restriction in regard to the reliefs they can claim, meaning an effective rate of at least 30%. Is that the case?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: For those with income of between €125,000 and €400,000 there is a graduated level to bring them up to 30%. The restriction on people with income over €400,000 resulted in additional income tax of €26 million and the restriction on those with adjusted income below that figure, but over €125,000, resulted in an additional €13 million. There were 521...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: The number of cases total 665 and the amount of relief used by those affected by the restriction in 2016 was €149 million. By far the biggest element was the carry forward of excess relief, with 346 people availing of it giving a total of €98 million, an average of €283,000 per individual. Is the excess carry forward related to the high-income individual's restriction?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: If a person has a restriction this year because he or she has an income of €500,000 and pays extra tax because of that restriction, he or she can carry it forward.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: The person can carry the relief forward, not the tax.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 9: Office of the Revenue Commissioners
Chapter 17: Revenue's Progress in Tackling Tobacco Smuggling
Chapter 18: Management of High Wealth Individuals' Tax Liabilities
Chapter 19: Corporation Tax Losses
(15 Nov 2018)

Seán Fleming: The amount of the relief claimed was €98 million at 30%. The people affected can carry it forward to a following year when they may have a lower income and can reduce their tax bill accordingly.

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