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Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: The answer was that it related to the wind down of operations but that is not true because the question related to 2006.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: The article also states:Up to the time the decision was made to close it in 2012, AIB Offshore saw itself playing a crucial role in the AIB group by getting business from 'high net worth individuals', the vast bulk of whom would be doing business with the bank for 'tax planning' reasons, the documents show. The resultant deposits could then be used by the group. Is that an accurate...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: Up to the time when the decision was made to close AIB Offshore in 2012.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: Mr. Byrne does not think that the majority of those who had offshore accounts with AIB were doing so for tax planning reasons.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: Does he have an opinion on it? He has expressed opinions on other matters.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: It seems that Mr. Byrne is willing to state opinions and come up with rationales when they do not point to what is staring everybody in the face, which is that these operations were to facilitate at least tax avoidance and probably tax evasion in terms of pre-1998 clients.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: A letter was sent on 15 September 2015 by Appleby to AIB for the attention of Andrew Smith, head of AIB group legal services. It comes in the context of Mr. Byrne being in AIB and he would have a certain responsibility for it. It states that Appleby had been instructed by AIB ISL Limited in respect of Mr. Smith's letter of 3 September 2015 in which he asked whether AIB ISL Limited would...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: I think it is the opposite. I ask Mr. Byrne to explain his statement. I asked him about this matter and he has repeatedly stated that this statement in the article was inaccurate: "Leaked files from the Isle of Man (IOM) offices of offshore law firm Appleby reveal Government-owned AIB also refused to give the Revenue Commissioners access to data on its offshore customers when responding to...

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: ------yet here is a letter to prove it.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: No, Ms Dooley stated that was not on foot of a High Court order nor a request by the Revenue Commissioners.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: This letter asks whether AIB Isle of Man consents to AIB reviewing customer data held in AIB's data server for documents relevant to the disclosures order made by the Irish High Court.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: No, not exactly. Mr. Byrne a moment ago stated it was nothing to do with the court order.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: That is an example of clever answers that try to avoid responding to questions. I appreciate Mr. Byrne is trying to say that is not true because the court order was not made in 2015, but there is a response illustrating that up to 2015, at which stage Mr. Byrne has to take responsibility, AIB Isle of Man refused to hand over information on clients flowing from a High Court order.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: When we go back through the transcripts we will find it is quite different and that Mr. Byrne tried to mislead the committee by saying the article was wrong.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: I accept that it was before Mr. Byrne's watch but does Mr. Byrne accept that there is a moral problem with AIB, having been bailed out with €7 billion of public funds, continuing to facilitate the robbery of other public funds by facilitating tax avoidance, at the very least? Is there a moral problem with that?

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: However, the witness hides behind the law in the Isle of Man-----

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: That is what the witness has been doing the entire time. That is what the letter reflects. It is hiding behind the law in the Isle of Man. That is why it is there.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: Yes, but the law is very friendly to banks in secrecy jurisdictions and in avoiding Revenue Commissioners officials getting information.

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Paradise Papers (Resumed): Allied Irish Banks (14 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: It is convenient that the bank happens to be established in two jurisdictions where the law means that the Revenue Commissioners cannot get access to information and facilitates people avoiding tax. The witness might say it was not the intention to do that, but if the bank is set up there of course people will do that.

European Council Meeting: Statements (13 Dec 2017)

Paul Murphy: See you, Taoiseach.

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