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Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: During the course of the summer the Department was finalising the report and the recommendations. The Comptroller and Auditor General, in his 2017 report, states that the Department indicated it expects to publish a new national cybersecurity strategy by the end of 2018. This is in writing. It is now nearing the end of 2018.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: The Secretary General has been busy with broadband. I note that there were to be meetings of an interdepartmental high level steering committee involving the national cybersecurity centre, the Department of the Taoiseach, an assistant commissioner from An Garda Síochána, a principal officer in the Department of Justice and Equality, a colonel from the Defence Forces and a...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: What is the function of that interdepartmental committee? Does it have a role or should it be disbanded?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: This was which committee?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: Who chairs that Cabinet committee? Is it a sub-committee?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: Is that chaired by the Taoiseach directly?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: The witnesses will understand that most people are confused by the difference between and operator of an essential service, OES, and a digital service provider, DSP. The Department's notes state that the digital service provider includes cloud computing, online sales and search engines. I assume these are all in the private sector.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: On the other hand, quite a few of the operators of essential services might be in the public service.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: Mr. Griffin listed some 60 entities as operators of essential services. Is the list published? Is it confidential? That is okay. How many of these entities are digital service providers?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: With whom do they register to make it known they are a digital service provider?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: I take it most of those DSPs are, by definition, transnational and operate across Europe and other continents.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: That is because of the multinational companies such as Google and so on.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: I am worried about the reputation of the State. If something happens with one of these companies that are headquartered in Ireland, will people say that cybersecurity was not up to the mark in Ireland? It might be the company's fault if there was a breach of its security system, but if its headquarters are in Ireland, the message can very easily travel the world - within an hour - that...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: I see in this report that the Minister is the competent authority in respect of the operators of essential services, which we spoke about, and the digital service providers. If there is an issue, there is some political and democratic accountability through the Minister. The document also says, however, that the Central Bank is the designated competent authority in respect of the financial...

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: I am sorry to introduce more complex issues at this hour of the evening, but we are nearly there.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: We are just about there.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: Okay.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: The Central Bank is the designated authority.

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: It states in the Comptroller and Auditor General's report that the Department published draft security measures and incident reporting guidelines in 2017 for the groups we mentioned for consultation. It is intended that these will be finalised following transposition of the directive. Has that been done or at what stage of preparation is that?

Public Accounts Committee: 2017 Annual Report of the Comptroller and Auditor General and Appropriation Accounts
Vote 29 - Department of Communications, Climate Action and Environment
Chapter 8 - Measures relating to Cyber Security
Chapter 9 - Energy Efficiency National Fund
(6 Dec 2018)

Seán Fleming: Last year.

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