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Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: The expertise is not there in the Circuit Court and it does not profess to it. We are not arguing about that. There is an appeal commissioner in place now, where the expertise exists, as I am sure the Minister of State agrees. I am sure he will also agree that people have appealed the decision of those experts and have won in the Circuit Court. Revenue did not appeal that to the High...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: I would argue that the only reason the Revenue Commissioners would not appeal the decision to the High Court is that they knew they would likely lose. They are not people to stand on the sidelines; they will pursue someone if they think they are right. History has shown us that if the process the Minister of State is putting in place had been there, many in the State would not have had...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Without going into that debate, I would stress that many citizens have been - I must be careful in terms of my parliamentary language-----

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: This is a particularly bad word. I am sure it appeared in the book at one stage. Many people did not have justice served by An Bord Pleanála and had no recourse. It is not our job to second-guess planners but some of the decisions were absolutely crazy. Individuals have been left high and dry as a result of those cases. I know some of them personally. Some decisions have touched...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: This provision is only being removed because of the original argument that people are using it to delay the process. If that is the case, there are other ways to address this. The number of people who are appealing is very small.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: I move amendment No. 25:In page 41, line 10, after "Court" to insert "or Circuit Court". I will submit this again on Report Stage.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: I move amendment No. 26:In page 41, between lines 14 and 15, to insert the following:"(3) Any person aggrieved by the determination of the Appeal Commissioners in any appeal against an assessment made on that person may, on giving notice in writing to the inspector or such other officer as the Revenue Commissioners shall authorise in that behalf (in this section referred to as ‘other...

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: I move amendment No. 27:In page 41, line 15, to delete "(3) The" and substitute "(13) The". I will resubmit this for reconsideration on Report Stage.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: I move amendment No. 28:In page 41, line 23, to delete "(4) This" and substitute "(14) This". I will withdraw this to resubmit it for consideration on Report Stage.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Can the appeals commissioner apply to the District Court at the end of this year, for that court to determine whether a failure or refusal referred to in subsection (1) by the person gives rise to the liability or penalty referred to in that subsection?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: It is not the High Court?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Would the District Court have any role in determining whether the person was liable for the penalty in the first place?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Obviously, in making such a determination, the District Court would need to be familiar with the tax code and be experts in this regard.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Sorry?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: Nobody is suggesting that it is. The Minister of State is jumping to conclusions here.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: There is a valid point here, however. They are not the experts in taxation.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: If the appeal commissioners are the best people to determine whether somebody is liable to a penalty or whether a tax liability applies, then why would we allow people in the District Court to do so, given that it does not profess to have that type of expertise, to use the Minister of State's own words in regard to the Circuit Court?

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: No, but it is not a case where one is going to the Circuit Court and saying, "We've made a determination. Please apply this €3,000 penalty to Mr. or Mrs. X". One is basically going to the District Court to determine whether there was a failure or refusal-----

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: -----referred to in subsection (1) by the person, and if that gives rise to a liability.

Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform: Select Sub-Committee on Finance: Finance (Tax Appeals) Bill 2015: Committee Stage (7 Oct 2015)

Pearse Doherty: If we just need to determine whether or not they turned up, which is obvious to any Tom, Dick or Harry, why do we have to tie up the District Court with such a simple matter? Are the appeal commissioners not competent to determine that they did not turn up and just levy the €3,000 fine, if it is that simple?

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