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Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: I move amendment No. 12:In page 19, line 3, to delete “tax.”.” and substitute the following:“tax.(12) Where this section applies relief under Part 16 shall not apply.”.”.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: I spoke on the amendment last night but I can speak more broadly on the section now. Section 10 inserts a new section after section 128E to provide for the introduction of a new share-option based relief for employees of SME companies, namely the key employee engagement programme, KEEP. It is designed to support SMEs in Ireland in competing with larger enterprises in the recruitment and...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: We estimate that over the medium term it will cost approximately €10 million. We do not expect that cost to be realised next year. We expect that the setup period for many companies will be, perhaps not prolonged, but into next year. Beyond that, when the scheme is ongoing, the cost will be approximately €10 million.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: Yes. The two main criteria in this regard are that the enterprise must employ fewer than 250 persons, as the Deputy has just said, and that it must have an annual turnover not exceeding €50 million or an annual balance sheet in total not exceeding €43 million. In addition, we have laid down a number of trading activities which will be excluded from the KEEP incentive. This...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: Yes, that certainly sounds feasible.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: That is correct. It is a tax expenditure, so there is a cost to us for doing it, but much of the engagement we have had with small and medium-sized companies that are active in particular sectors within our economy point to the fact that companies far larger than them have share option schemes that they are able to fund by their scale. They have indicated to us that a scheme such as this...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: My experience, having dealt with this issue in recent months, is that the availability of share option schemes has changed within our economy. It rarely includes, to be fair to the Deputy's point, people on low incomes - I acknowledge that - but one of the developments that has occurred is that it now includes more and more middle-income employees, depending on the kind of industry they are...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: That is correct. The Bill states "ordinary share".

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: I have been informed that it depends on the type of company, and Revenue guidelines are available to help with that. When we discuss the relevant section, I will get more information for the Deputy on this point, but I would have thought that in the vast majority of cases, this would be granted to companies that are quoted in some way because, of course, this is a share-based scheme, and in...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: Since 2008, accelerated capital allowances have been available for certain energy-efficient equipment. The full amount of the allowance can therefore be deducted in the first year rather than over the standard eight years. The scheme is designed to improve energy efficiency among Irish companies and sole traders and assist Ireland in meeting our national targets and both binding and...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: I will have to come back to the Deputy on that.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: That information is available but I do not have it to hand. I will come back to the Deputy on it.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: I imagine that when the scheme was initially introduced it had a clause by which it could be ended in case the scheme was not meeting the objectives set for it. When I reviewed all of these allowances with my officials in advance of the Finance Bill, I received advice that this scheme was of help in delivering energy efficiency goals for Irish companies and the continuation of the scheme...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: It is not my objective to try to incentivise the use of the scheme by a particular date. By putting it down for the end of 2020, I recognise that the end date of the scheme is still quite a bit away. The experience I have of such schemes is that at times, there can be changes in technology and in how the allowances are used. It is helpful to have a point at which the scheme could end, to...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: It is. As we see more focus on climate change and where Ireland stands with its emissions, I expect that schemes such as this will become more prominent.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: In 2014, the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources undertook an analysis of the scheme. The policy review concluded that the scheme provided benefits to the delivery of the policy objectives I have described and that it provided value for money. On the basis of that review in 2014, it was concluded that the scheme continued to be effective. Given that the review of the...

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: The figure of €1.1 million was for 65 claimants in 2015. The figure was €900,000 for 57 claimants in 2014. The figure was €700,000 for 65 claimants in 2013.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: Yes, that is possible.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: It is in the first year, which is the same thing as the year of purchase.

Select Committee on Finance, Public Expenditure and Reform, and Taoiseach: Finance Bill 2017: Committee Stage (Resumed) (8 Nov 2017)

Paschal Donohoe: Eight years.

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